Help please! Have I got a leak?

[caro]

Hi

I'm sorry if this is going to be long-winded, but I had a water pump that served the hot and cold water to the whole of my house, but after just two and a half years it started to leak (hot side). I discovered that it was possible to fit a seal kit and the pump engineer came on Saturday morning to do it.

When he took it apart it was absolutely full of limescale, so full in fact that he said he'd never seen anything like it before. The limescale could not be rubbed if, nor scraped off, he said it was almost like some process had coated it. He couldn't repair it as it was so bad that the pump shaft broke during his endeavours. The impeller and everthing was caked in this stuff. I do live in a hard water area, but in the four years I have lived here I have only discaled the kettle once so it does seem pretty odd.

I had already arranged for him to change some valves and the flange as he thought the reason it was leaking was because air was being drawn into the pump causing it to leak. This work has now been completed and I have a new pump.

My worry is why the huge amount of limescale. He checked the temperature of my water, that is just under 60 degrees and he also asked me if I have had a dripping tap as he thinks the limescale may be due to water running through the pump at all times. I have not had a dripping tap. Then he suggested that maybe I have a leak in the hot water system, most likely under the floorboards as there is no sign of anything anywhere else.

This is my dilema. Based on this experience of excessive limescale in the pump, is this enough to tear the house apart looking under the suspended timber floor for a leak. Obviously this is a huge upheaval. I have a cloakroom with laminate flooring, a kitchen with Karndean flooring and a utility area tiled out? Hubby is of the opinion that we should just leave things but I'm going around with my head to the floor listening for anything dripping, but of course I can hear anything! Would the air being drawn through the pump cause the limescale?

Any thoughts on what might have lead us here would be very gratefully received.

Caro

 

[easyt]

Are you on a water meter. When I thought I had a leak the local waterboard fitted a temporary watermeter. Straight away it was evident that there was no leak. Even a slowly dripping tap showed.

 

[caro]

Thanks easyt for replying.

No I am not on a meter. So your water board fitted something temporarily for you? Did they charge? Well that might be useful. I wonder if Wessex Water do this.

Caro

 

[easyt]

Yes it was f.o.c. I know that you can have a meter fitted here if you request and, if you are not happy at the end of 12 months they will take it out. I think that is widespread. But in this case they just unscrewed the tap at the mains and screwed a temporary meter on. The guy was here 20 mins. I asked how sensitive the meters are and he said it would spot a dripping tap. So I went into the kitchen and set the tap dripping at about 1 drip every 30 seconds. Obviously the number dials didn't whizz around but there is a little star shaped disc on the meter and you could see this twitch.

 

[caro]

Trying to get me head round it easyt.

My leak is not a mains leak though, the leak would be from the internal hot water pipe work. Would it still show up on a meter?

Caro

 

[easyt]

IF IT IS LEAKING FROM ANYWHERE THEN IT MUST BE REPLACED BY WATER FROM THE MAINS. (oops sorry about caps).

 

[easyt]

what sort of heating have you got. Do you have a feed and expansion tank in the loft?

 

[caro]

Central heating is gas with F&E tank feeding hot water cylinder which is where the water pump takes its hot water.

Caro

 

[Dannypipe]

I'm in a hardwater area and it never ceases to amaze me the damage limescale can do.

I have a clients shower valve soaking in vinegar in my shed as we speak. It's so scaled that I can't open it to change the cartridge.

So you may well have a leak, or it may just be that the water is very hard, and it's killed your pump (via the hot side).

 

[easyt]

Central heating is gas with F&E tank feeding hot water cylinder which is where the water pump takes its hot water.

Caro

Well, if the system is leaking then presumably the ball valve at the F&E tank must be running/dripping to replace the loss. Have you checked it?

 

[caro]

Oh sorry, this is a bit over my head. Maybe my F&E tank does not feed my hot water. I know I have one and that it is for the central heating. I'm suprised my plumber did not think of checking that out because he went into the loft.

Caro

 

[helpsy]

Your cold water storage cistern(CWSC) stores the water for the cylinder it shoukld be either 25/50 gallon tank dependant on whether you have a dirct or indirect cold water system. The F&E is the smaller of your tanks.
Where abouts in the wessex water area are you?

 

[caro]

Hi Helpsy

Nearest large town Bournemouth.

Caro

 

[WaterTight]

find a way to mark the water level in your larger of your two water storage cisterns in the loft, then tie up the arm (place bit of wood/pipe/long ruler over the top of tank and tie arm up wih string) - leave it overnight, try and give it a good 10 hours of so - don't run any taps. then go check it again. if there's a leak sufficient enough to have caused this the level will have dropped.

 

[easyt]

Looking at initial post pump is on the hot/cold water. So good advice Watertight.

But if his water authority are as helpful as mine a temporary meter is easiest.

 

[easyt]

I doubt that there is a leak tough. I can't see a small drip making much difference to the amount of water passing through the system. If it was significant should be able to hear it by using a sounding stick on the stop tap and listening with it against his ear or else the ball valve in the header tank would be heard dripping with the loft hatch off unless storage tank is really well insulated.

 

[caro]

That was a very good clue easyt. I've had my loft hatch open this morning and to my dismay the water tank is contantly dripping. I went out for three hours, came back and still the dripping noise.

Guess that means I definitely have a leak! But where the heck I start looking for it lord only knows.

 

[easyt]

That's providing your overflow isn't dripping outside. Just check in case the ball valve is simply leaking and overflowing. If overflow isn't dripping and the toilet cistern valve (if it is gravity fed) or a tap isn't dripping then it sounds like you have a leak. But do check those first. (I presume any outside tap is mains fed but if not then check that as well.

 

[caro]

Overflow definitely not dripping. Haven't noticed the toilets running. Bearing in mind that in my original post it was the hot water side of the pump that was badly scaled seems it is the hot that is leaking somewhere.

Caro

 

[Plumbstar Tom]

if the water tank is dripping from the inlet off the mains to it i t could mean a faulty washer in the fill valve not shutting it off fully

and not neccessarily a leak

 

[easyt]

if the water tank is dripping from the inlet off the mains to it i t could mean a faulty washer in the fill valve not shutting it off fully

and not neccessarily a leak

If you were able to enter the loft and slightly raise the ball float you would know. If it stops - probably a leak. As I said before I doubt that there is a leak. - Always assume the best and check for the worst if pipes are inaccessible and no apparent leak.