Oil Boiler Issues

[Cowe_Plumbing]

Good evening all,

I am a new member to the forum, I have used the site regularly for help & advice from van shelving tips to with boiler breakdowns. I am very grateful for all I have read so far & look forward to posting a bit more in the future.

I mainly carry out oil boiler breakdowns & servicing as I enjoy this aspect of the trade as I find it a good challenge when coming up against issues that take a bit of thinking, Until tonight that was!

For the past few weeks I have been having an issue with an oil boiler, The issue being that I cannot get the boiler to continue to run for more than an hour......on the odd occasion it has lasted around half a day the customer has told me. I am now the third plumber/heating engineer to take a look with no joy so far...........

First things first...The customer called to say "my heating is only running for a maximum of an hour, it has been serviced about a month ago & the guy that has been working on it can't get it going. He has then recommended another plumber but he is also having no luck even after installing a new flue, Can you help?"
Now my initial thought was, Oil pump/filters or oil line blockage. It certainly sounded to me like fuel, But now I am not so sure.

What we have installed is a camray 5 internal oil boiler in the garage fitted with a single stage RDB Riello burner, It is fed from a one pipe system with 2 filters - one at the tank & one fitted on the outside of the casing then there was a compression 90 bend just before the oil line enters the burner.

So on arrival I noticed that the tank master was corroded, oil couldn't be switched off, no other valve on the line. then the filter by the burner (just before entering the casing) & thought, I doubt the paper filter had been changed in either as it wasn't possible to turn the oil off. I went about getting a spare oil tank so I could take all oil out & replace the tank master then when I could isolate the rest of the line I removed the oil line at either end & replaced it as it was really dirty after blowing it out, I then replaced the complete filter & fitted it to the outside wall & fitted a fire valve with a two pipe system (tigerloop) just in case it was a vacuum issue (over 0.4 bar needs a two pipe system I think?) with mini ball valve just before the new filter on the out side wall, I also at this point changed the oil pump & reset to MI at 115 psi with a new nozzle .50 x 85 EH - The boiler then only ran for an hour again. I had all spare parts for the burner, so I have since replaced systematically the oil pump & nozzle, (again in case of a bad one & again change the nozzle for a hallow spray) coil, photocell, electrodes, motor, capacitor, control box, blast tube, fan done a service setting the c02 at 11.50% as recommended by Kevin at Riello in case there was too much air causing the flame to go out, I have also installed a new burner as I thought this would be a short term solution as I would hate to charge for a new burner as there must be an issue with the current one. I also check on the 2nd/3rd visit that there was 240 V at the control box & I had 237 V so was satisfied with that.

Is there anyone out there that can help me out here please? It may be something so obvious but Riello say they can't help & no other plumbers can suggest anything more to me as I have called 5 local guys & explained my issue. It is driving me mad here haha.

Sorry for the essay just wanted to be sure you were all in the loop as best I could.

Many thanks in advance,
Allen (Y)

 

[Dotty]

What draught are you getting on the flue?

 

[SimonG]

So its going to lockout after an initial burn?

Getting any soot at the photocell?

Have you tried at 10.5 co2?

 

[SimonG]

Is it sucking its own poc? Have you tried with no snorkel?

 

[Cowe_Plumbing]

Thanks for the replies.

Croppie
I am not 100% sure how to test for this? or do you mean air damper setting?
Air setting is at 5, A bit high as MI suggests 1 - 2 but it runs far to rich then (possibly the issue)

SimonG
I have tried running it at 10%, 10.5% 11%, 11.5%, 12% & 12.5% as I have been back every day for an hour for 3 weeks.
I removed the air intake as I have seen this work before but usually when the fan was struggling to draw or flue was corroded.
No soot at all, burner is really clean.

Sorry guys not sure how to tag if possible?

Ta

 

[Cowe_Plumbing]

Yes just going to lock-out but as soon as I press the reset it fires up no problems then runs for another hour or so then same again & it will do this all day.

 

[Dotty]

Use the pressure gauge on your fga to see what draw up the flue you're getting. Should be getting 2-4 millibar.

 

[Cowe_Plumbing]

Think it was okay but can double check tomorrow. I checked it all off against MI & all was well once serviced it again tonight just did it in case anything was moving & as I had been playing around with the Co2 settings. Although the air setting is set to 5 & MI suggests 1 - 2 but I have come across this a good few times & never had an issue. Thanks for your help though SimonG it is greatly appreciated.

 

[Cowe_Plumbing]

And Croppie, Thought it was Simon posting again sorry.

 

[joni os]

Have you sucked from 25 litres of known quality to rule out contamination?

 

[Cowe_Plumbing]

Yeah I took about 10- 15 Litre out of another oil tank where I was servicing another boiler that was running with no issues as the fuel depo wont supply me with oil under 500 Litres.

 

[smtplumbing]

just randomly thinking is it reset right away could it be the control box that is away.

The other thing is save your self the heart break and call the manufacturer out sometimes you just need to walk away from job like this

 

[Unregistered]

The manufacturers will not attend due to the location of the boiler. They have offers advice as have riello but so far it hasn't made a difference to the way the boiler has ran.
It is almost getting to the point that labour costs will out weight the price of another boiler, I am not keen on this as I hate the thought of something mechanical beating me, there is an issue for sure so it is going to be possible to sort it but it is getting expensive for the customer or me as it is hard to charge. Even if I do go down the route of another boiler I can't be sure that it will be any better....
Thanks for all your help so far chaps,

 

[Best]

Next time wait and let the burner run the hour. That way you will find out if the burner fails and goes to lockout while it was running, or if it lockout on the cycle.

 

[Kevin D]

What voltage are you getting off the control winding off the motor. It's a white wire, from memory but memory is crap these days it should be around 60v.
And a daft question, it's not running gas oil is it?

 

[fishnchips]

Bit late sorry, is the pump shifting the heat and not overheating - check flues seals,

 

[OilBoy]

How has this one ended??

Kevin D - 50v on the white wire :smile:

Vacuum at the tank? Checked the tank vent?

Hope it's running OK now, sounds like a big bill for the customer :rolleyes2:

 

[lame plumber]

or it could be just a solenoid needing swapping for a new one on the fuel pump

 

[Bunker]

You sure its locking out and not going off on the stat? Have you checked the custards nomenclature? Ive had this, even recently...Im chasing a lock out but it turns out to be control related