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stuco

Hi, this is probably a really basic thing, but I'm a complete novice.

Have connected a wall hung toilet to a Grohe rapid frame system. I'm using the connector supplied to connect cistern output to inlet on toilet. It looks like a tube with 3 rubber flanges on one end - sorry, don't know the technical term:eek:. Have cut it to size and pushed the flanged end into the back of the loo and the plain end into the frame side - this already has a ruuber o ring seal in.

When I flush the loo I'm getting water pouring from back of loo - not talking the odd drip here! Have flushed loo with a bucket of water and it seems dry so I'm assuming its not leaking from soil connector, but from the actual cistern connection. Although I can't see exactly where water is coming from, because of where its appearing, I'm guessing its from the toilet end of cistern connection.

Are these connections supposed to be sealed in somehow extra?

Thanks in advance.
 
no they are a simple push in connection,
make sure the pipe is not pushed too far into the pan.
the flush pipe is to go only the depth of the flush cone (rubber bung).
and dont stress the joint.
 
I had a similar problem fitting a concealed cistern toilet, it wasn't wall hung but the pan fitted flush to the framework when fitted. The water didn't gush out but after every flush a pool of water appeared from under the pan. It turned out to be a hairline crack in the pan somewhere just after the rubber bung.
 
i agree with redsaw a crack in the pan is rare more likely sparge pipe in to far or distorted rubber
 
Thanks for the replies. Hoping to get a spare hour or so tomorrow so will have another go. I'll try cutting the pipe a little shorter but is there some way of making sure the pipe fully inserts into the cistern end and doesn't push through into the pan end instead?
 
Thanks for the replies. Hoping to get a spare hour or so tomorrow so will have another go. I'll try cutting the pipe a little shorter but is there some way of making sure the pipe fully inserts into the cistern end and doesn't push through into the pan end instead?
yes,!.

its called accurate measurement.

wall to cistern outlet center to toilet pan inlet plus insert.
toilet pan insert center to max hight (less 1'') into syphon tube outlet.
put flush pipe into syphon, dont screw on,
put flush cone into pan inlet,
now lightly screw up cistern nut.
slide flush/p into cone.
 
Hi,

thought I already had...
Don't think I explained it properly - the cistern is part of a concealed Grohe rapid frame, which obviously has to be boxed in before the wc can be mounted. Have done this and this leaves the cistern end (syphon tube?) just ready to have the tube pushed into it. There is no screw or way of clamping this end of the tube to hold it in place, therefore enabling the other end to push into the flush cone the correct amount.

What I can't get straight in my head is that if both ends are push in, what stops the flush pipe sliding more into the toilet cone instead of back into the cistern connection. Is it simply a path of least resistance and the cone is a harder push?

Cheers.
 
if there is any movement in the flushpipe when you push the pan back it will just push back against the pressure of the flush cone.
 
Ok, still having problems! Have tried,

1, Shortening the flush pipe - but when reading back through the posts it sounds as if it is normal for the flush pipe to be able to project further than the flush cone into the loo ?
"make sure the pipe is not pushed too far into the pan.
the flush pipe is to go only the depth of the flush cone "
The bit on the loo is only deep enough to take the flush cone and the pipe could not project any further anyway...

2, A new different bung

3, Siliconing the whole thing in

4, A longer flush pipe (40mm waste off cut) but this was slack enough to allow leaking from the cistern end of things so a bit worried that I'm going to have to stick to grohe supplies.

It still LEAKS!!

Now looking at flexible flush pipes as I'm pretty sure part of the problem is that its not a horizontal line from the rear of loo to frame. Also seen external flush cones. Any thoughts/comments on if these will possibly work or any other suggestions gratefully recieved.
 
yes go buy new cones there only a quid each.
but have said before, the pipe has to be measured and aligned correctly to avoid leaks.
could just be a crap cone seal have seen before, dont silicone it unless you leave it undisturbed 24hrs.
 
Left it for 24 hours with the new seal in before flushing but doesn't seem to have made any difference. Definately think its something to do with the toilet not being perfectly lined up with the cistern outlet so thats why I'm considering a flexi one. My only worry is that the the cistern oulet is perfectly matched to the pipe that is supplied with the frame kit and I'm wondering if a standard flexi connector will be slack in the cistern side...
Still, one leak at a time eh?
 
The flush pipe should be horizontal and go itno the pan at 90 degrees, not at a cocked angle. If its not straight then you need to adjust the fittings until it is. I wouldn't even start to think about using other components, these grohe frames are quality gear and wont leak if you fit it right. If your getting a gush then its badly out of line.

ps is there no way you can get access to the back of the pan when you flush it, even just a hand in there, to feel where its coming from, and feel if its connected properly. You can sometimes use a mirror to look down through the flush button aperture.
 
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after half a dozen attempts, there is something wrong or its nat been done right.

take the loo outside put pipe in and run water thru with hose or watering can and see if it leaks, if not get it fixed right.

if pressure is applied downwards to the pipe even slightly it will leak.


put up some pics
 
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P09-01-11_20.05[01].jpgP30-12-10_21.31.jpgP09-01-11_20.05.jpg

The 1st photo shows the amount of water after 1 flush and the next 2 the boxed in frame and with toilet. The frame dictates that the waste and flush are a set amount apart and the toilet has to hang on the fixed bolts. The toilet obviously has a fixed waste and flush so am now wondering if the 2 are incompatible. Have been waiting of silicone to dry since Thursday and it still hasn't sealed so next job is to take it back off and flush through in the garden (Redsaw).
 
are the holes the same size as the pipes or larger, because the upper hole is slightly off to the right compared to the hole for the soil. possibly the flush pipe comes into the pan at a slight angle.
 
The holes in the plasterboard are slightly larger than than the pipe outlets. The photo without wc was taken just after I put plasterboard on so the soil pipe isn't shown. I might enlarge hole around the cistern outlet to make sure the plasterboard isn't pushing the pipe off in any way.

Is it best to start with flush pipe in wc and bring to cistern or put pipe in cistern and bring wc to pipe?
 
ps does anyone know the best place to get a grohe replacement flush pipe. I'm going to start with a fresh one but having trouble tracking spares down.
 
if thats being tiled id cut a hatch above the pan so you can see and then make good after only needs a couple of battens and screw the plasterboard you cut out back
definatly pipe in cistern first
 
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ps does anyone know the best place to get a grohe replacement flush pipe. I'm going to start with a fresh one but having trouble tracking spares down.
[DLMURL="http://www.concept-zen.com/index.php?app=gbu0&ns=catshow&ref=Grohe_Spare_Parts&count=30&offset=30"]Grohe Spare Parts[/DLMURL]
 
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hang on,
lets make it simple,
get rid of the p/board and get your nose behind the pan and test it on 1st fix as you will see whats going on?.
 
Ah, never thought of that :) Will give that a try.
Have got another flush pipe on order in case I need it as well.
 
Sorry, NickH, had taken that on board as well, using mirror etc, just the obvious of taking off the whole plasterboard never occurred to me until it was pointed out... Need to start kicking my brain into gear me thinks!
 
Just an update - new pipe arrived, cut to the required length, went in like a dream, still leaking. Before we (got my dad on the case as well) went to the length of taking the plasterboard off, we managed to get some paper towel wrapped around the flush pipe and flushed toilet. Paper totally dry, bucket of water down loo and still dry but leaking when flushed.

Took toilet back off wall (again) and had a really good look but couldn't see anything untoward. Stood toilet upside down and filled the manufacturing holes with water and water starts running out of the rim. Soooo, seems like there's some kind of connection/crack between the flush system and the body of the toilet. This was mentioned in one of the first replys but never thought about it being an internal fault. I assumed it would be visible. Off to send an email to the toilet supplier but just hope they aren't too funny as we've had the toilet for a few months until we got around to that bit....
 
I had a leaking loo about 6 months ago and after much messing about found it was the internal joints inside the pan. It definately does happen.
 
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