Heating extension - Multiple Flow / Return Tee's very close to each other

[pigsfoot]

HI, We are just finishing an extension thats been built and the heating pipework has now been run in. The pipework is for three new Rads, two column ( two rather than one big one ) and another rad in an en-suite. Pipework from original supply is all 22mm ( as per original supply ) to the first Tee which then reduces to 15mm. The heating system is open vented.

The question is, we seem to be having an issue with the two column rads in that they are noisy and you can hear the water flow through them. I have been bleeding them now for 4 days and get a small amount of air but nothing major.

The design of the pipework is the main feed runs under the floor along the middle of the room and Tees off to each column rad which are on opposite sides of the room. Both the Flow and Return Tees are very close to each other for each rad, no more than 300mm apart. Its also worth mentioning the pipework to the ensuite is in but not connected to anything and just has stop ends on the flow and return pipe.

I was wondering if the issue with noise is because the Tees are so close to each other, could one tee be feeding into the other perhaps ?? or is it simply that the en-suite pipe is not connected to anything, has no flow and has air trapped?

Any advice would be appreciated. We are two weeks away from plastering the ceiling below so i have an opportunity to make any changes.

Thanks

 

[steadyon]

1. The column radiators may be noisy, but are they working properly, with even heat over the whole surface?
2. Can't see why the closeness of the tees should cause any issues.
3. If the stop ends on the en-suite pipes are compression stop ends, why not loosen them slightly to let air out and tighten them as soon as water appears. If they are push fit or soldered, not so easy, but might still be worth trying. Might need pipe freezing or a drain down.

 

[pigsfoot]

Hi @steadyon that great thanks. The column rads are working properly, not quite even heat over the whole thing but close enough. I think its just the column closest to the TRV on the front that is slightly colder than the others if that means anything.

Re the stop ends, they are push fit but will be like that for some months to come as i need to save up my pennies for the en-suite . What i'll do is get a couple of inline push fit value's so i can open them slightly and try to purge the air.

Thanks

 

[Scott_D]

Could be trapped air.
Lots of column rads are directional

 

[pigsfoot]

Just a thought. the column rads that are noisy are the closest to my heating pump. As we have added several new rads i turn teh pump up from setting two to setting three. Could this be causing the noise. Not sure its air as i'm not getting that much come out. However i have just realised i have been bleeding the system majority of teh time when the heating is on and all lock valves fully open

 

[Brambles]

Scott d makes a good point. Reread the installation instructions for the column radiators. They need to be installed the correct way round / up. If they need a flow divertor make sure it is fitted in the correct location. If the flow is controlled by internal baffles double check the orientation of the radiator.

Thereafter: noise will probably be trapped air, unbalanced radiators and / or too high a velocity.

 

[Ben-gee]

Have you tried turning the pump speed down?

 

[pigsfoot]

Hi all, thanks for the great feedback, much appreciated.

I have a spare column rad thats not been fitted yet, slightly different in that its single and not double but having looked at it the inlet / outlet feed is just a tube both top and bottom with the columns attached. You can see straight through each main pipe and just make out the holes that connect to the columns. Looking at it, it's the same top and bottom so i'm confident there is no right / wrong / up / down way round. However... i just doubled checked the instructions ( when i say checked, i mean read for the first time ) and the manufacturer does recommend a baffle is fitted if both feeds are at the bottom which mine are, flow on the right, return on the left.

I guess its a trip to toolstation for a couple of baffles, a drain down, fitting and refill.

Can i just check, am i right in reading that only a baffle needs to be fitted on the flow side ?

Thanks

 

[Brambles]

I am not sure that there is a definitive answer.

The last ones I fitted were Purmo Forza, they required a flow diverter on the flow inlet.

However, earlier this week I scratched one, so turned it round, but could not easily remove the flow diverter ( I had put it in with the wrong type of Loctite!!) - so the flow diverter was essentially acting as a baffle on the return. It seems to work ok.

I am sure that others will have different opinions - and they are probably right - but I fit a lot of old reconditioned cast iron radiators and they are quite difficult to both balance and keep quite when running.

 

[John.g]

Someone on here said that diverter plugs come loose with some vertical rads to allow flow from either side and are inserted a short distance in from the flow end, might be worth considering if suitable plugs available as it should give better circulation and allow the pump speed/mode to be reduced, speed 3 in most modern circ pumps is quite powerful, leading to noise,.