Benefits/Advantages of Taking on an Apprentice

[village idiot]

There comes a time when you suddenly realise that the work load is ''getting on top'' of you. Then you start to consider if it may be reasonable to take on an apprentice?

My worry is all your hard work can go down the drain if they put their foot through a customers ceiling or similar incidences. Is it really worth taking on this extra responsibility? This is going to be a very cold winter (I hope the snow keeps away or one might not be able to attend emergency calls). So the work load will quadruple. In effect, I am thinking may be it is time to take on an apprentice or two?

 

[SimonG]

I think you've missed the boat for this winter, unless you find a very gifted individual, I would think to start that an apprentice would slow you down initially. Not ever having one though I can't speak from experience.

 

[hammers4spanner]

wouldnt bother more aggro than they are worth

 

[Jacko]

as an apprentice my self i think apprenticeships are a good thing, we all have to start somewhere some how and less and less people are taking on apprentices.

 

[SimonG]

as an apprentice my self i think apprenticeships are a good thing, we all have to start somewhere some how and less and less people are taking on apprentices.

Hard enough working for one wage without being able to do less and needing to find two wages.

One day I have every intention of taking somebody on, but not until I'm working for fun and not paying rent/mortgage etc.

 

[cr0ft]

An apprentice costs you £2.80 odd an hour although I would suggest you offer a bit more if you want to attract a good one. Like has been said, a rubbish one will cost you a fortune. Find a good one though and you are onto a winner. I have got a decent one after trying 4 other rubbish ones. Good news is I had them all for a trial week (i.e. free) first and got shot of them quickly.

Try and find one who is ex-military, they have a great work ethic in general.

Even from his first week, a good one should be helping you do at least one more job a week to cover his wage, the day mine doesn't is the day I have to question whether it's worth it.

There is a £1,500 government grant at the moment for each one you take on and keep for 12 months. CITB also do quite good grants too, in the thousands of pounds.

 

[wetdrip]

Hi, where are you based?
If Coventry, see here:
http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/g...till-looking-gas-safe-registered-plumber.html

My nipper isn't ex-military;however he got his first Dan at the tender age of nine, through the British Combat Association.So, he's disciplined.

 

[village idiot]

wouldnt bother more aggro than they are worth

To be honest, I get about TWO calls a week from ''kids'' looking for apprenticeship positions. One of the problems I have is that even at that initial stage, they present themselves too ''casually''?

''hello, my name is .... and I just finished my level 2 city & guilds plumbing course. I just wondered if it was possible to join your company''? So I tell him to send more details to my email address as I am at work and not convenient time to talk. Most do not do that. The few who do make no effort to present themselves in a true light?
If you are not even prepared to tell me how old you are and what qualifications etc, how am I expected to help? I admit plumbing is classed as a ''manual job'', but believe you me, you've got to be able to think on your feet when the occasion calls for it.

I do have a few who plead that they are prepared to ''work for free'' as they just want the experience, but the worry of what damage they can 'throw up' when your back is turned, leaves me worried. I say so as five years ago, I took on an apprentice who just lasted a day, but I had to repair the customers ceiling he had damaged while we were replacing a complete bathroom.

 

[lame plumber]

I wonder if a nice smellimng girlie apprentice might change my mind about having one, as far as lads go I gave up a while back, how can anyone remove a roller garage door from its mountings by just opening it?

girlie interviews only after photos of your last holiday in Magaluff have been received and I have met your mum

 

[basildog]

It is not just aprentices though I am afraid as several years ago when I was building the plumber had a leak in a newly built restaurant extension ,so shouted quick someone make a hole in the ceiling while I turn the water off !
To the amazement of the other guys one of the groundworkers went up the loft ladder and just stamped his rigger boot straight through a brand new ceiling !
The chippy was grabbing a screwdriver to do what was really needed but too late !

 

[lame plumber]

why bother making a hole, plaster board dries ok if leaks is stopped promptly. Over reaction all round on that one

 

[wetdrip]

I wonder if a nice smellimng girlie apprentice might change my mind about having one, as far as lads go I gave up a while back, how can anyone remove a roller garage door from its mountings by just opening it?

girlie interviews only after photos of your last holiday in Magaluff have been received and I have met your mum

If my nipper was prepared to have a sex change would that qualify?

 

[kay-jay]

Ive toyed with the idea, mainly when busy and an extra pair of hands would be an asset. But you never know whats gonna happen mext week or the week after. Four years is a hell of a commitment for a one man band which 90 odd percent of us are.

Having said that I do have a lad with me who is qualified with no experience. We help each other out on an ad hoc experience for labour basis. I give him experience and he removes the teeth from my core bits....


You know who you are jam1979

 

[TimeServed]

I had a level 2 apprentice lad in the summer for about 4 weeks, didn't really pay him much at all which was great for me and he was happy to be getting experience but in the end i found it really slow me down and having to pick him up from bus station was a pain.... Although there are some days when I really wish I had him with me!

 

[ExArmy]

in my opinion, taking on an apprentice is a good idea. it's progress, the future, or whatever. if you don't take on an apprentice, you still have to do all the rubbish jobs yourself, you still have to get your own tools out of the van, and put them all away at the end of the day and in 4 years you will still be struggling away on your own as a one man band. there is a risk they can mess up, but nothing ventured, nothing gained. if you have an apprentice, so you charge your customers more money to cover their wage and give them all the simple mundane jobs to do, freeing you up to get on with the real job. think of it this way, if you earn £21.44 an hour, thats what they cost for a day. so then as long as the apprentice saves you one one hour of labour a day, then it's covered. plus you don't actually charge people out at what you pay them (1st rule of employing people) so if you add £4 on your hourly rate then over time the extra money should help pay for tools they break/lose and damage they cause
i know it may sound like "give them all the crap jobs to do" is not a very good strategy for teaching, but theres just not enough crap jobs for them to do ALL day, so at some point they inevitebly end up with nothing to do, therefore watching you work, passing you tools and thus learning the trade. then eventually as long as they are any good, you start giving them more responsibility and more money, untill eventually you have a fully trained man and you can leave them on jobs, pay them an "on the books" rate , and charge them out at a "self employed rate" and then you pocket the difference and make more money!

 

[lame plumber]

your se rate is far to low old son!

 

[SimonG]

in my opinion, taking on an apprentice is a good idea. it's progress, the future, or whatever. if you don't take on an apprentice, you still have to do all the rubbish jobs yourself, you still have to get your own tools out of the van, and put them all away at the end of the day and in 4 years you will still be struggling away on your own as a one man band. there is a risk they can mess up, but nothing ventured, nothing gained. if you have an apprentice, so you charge your customers more money to cover their wage and give them all the simple mundane jobs to do, freeing you up to get on with the real job. think of it this way, if you earn £21.44 an hour, thats what they cost for a day. so then as long as the apprentice saves you one one hour of labour a day, then it's covered. plus you don't actually charge people out at what you pay them (1st rule of employing people) so if you add £4 on your hourly rate then over time the extra money should help pay for tools they break/lose and damage they cause
i know it may sound like "give them all the crap jobs to do" is not a very good strategy for teaching, but theres just not enough crap jobs for them to do ALL day, so at some point they inevitebly end up with nothing to do, therefore watching you work, passing you tools and thus learning the trade. then eventually as long as they are any good, you start giving them more responsibility and more money, untill eventually you have a fully trained man and you can leave them on jobs, pay them an "on the books" rate (i.e £12), and charge them out at a "self employed rate" (£20) and then you pocket the difference!

£20 an hour self employed hmmmmmm.

and after 4 years your back to working on your own as he takes everything you've taught him and sets up in competition knowing all your regulars and what you charge.

Like I said, in my later years I'll take someone on, pass on my wisdom and then they can please themselves, whilst I pick and chose what I do for my beer and holiday money.

Selfish?, probably, but I couldn't give a Shi'ite. I'm a sole trader, I'm happy with what I earn and to maintain the status quo I will train 1 up as I pack in

 

[ExArmy]

yeah a bit low, to be honest i was thinking of a rate for a newly qualified bloke. i've editied it to remove the rates, anyway, the important bit there is the difference between the 2 rates

 

[ExArmy]

and after 4 years your back to working on your own as he takes everything you've taught him and sets up in competition knowing all your regulars and what you charge.

you could always get another one! but seriously, this does and could happen, but not really that likely to happen if you take on a 16 year old, when they are time served they will be 20, at that age you think they are going to WANT to set up on their own? let alone have the money to set up on their own? i wouldn;t worry too much about that

 

[SimonG]

Not for me.

 

[Macca2009]

I agree, remember lads we all started out somewhere.

as an apprentice my self i think apprenticeships are a good thing, we all have to start somewhere some how and less and less people are taking on apprentices.

 

[dom brennan]

im an apprentice just going in my second year doing level 2 and i may slow my boss down on some jobs but when he has a big job on like a full central heating job, he does all the boiler work while i do all the radiators and pipe them all up and on bathroom jobs we do half each so that means we do it twice as quick which means he can get twice as much work which means more money for him. he has just started letting me go to jobs on my own too, which also mean double the money for him so its win win for both of us im getting experience and hes getting more money

 

[jase158]

I have a 25 year old starting Monday, seems keen. only wants £100 per week. I am signing him up for 1 year initially with a pay review in 6 months. If he tidies my van and cleans my work space I will be happy. there wont be much for him to do most of the time but gives me someone to talk to, can get the radio out the van (which I forget most of the time) and hopefully give me more time to think rather then going to the van and smoking so much!!

 

[Macca2009]

Bit Jimmy Savile like there but yeah I see what you mean, might give a different outlok to builders arse syndrome. Tight low waist trouser and thong provided with uniform lol

I wonder if a nice smellimng girlie apprentice might change my mind about having one, as far as lads go I gave up a while back, how can anyone remove a roller garage door from its mountings by just opening it?

girlie interviews only after photos of your last holiday in Magaluff have been received and I have met your mum

 

[SimonG]

Yes, I started as an apprentice, but with a big company. But I don't feel indebted to do the same myself. I'm not empire building and don't need the hassle.

Fair play to those that do take apprentices on, but not for me.

But then why take an apprentice and have to pay when there's a constant stream of people from fast track courses that will work for free? Although a lot seem to disappear when an actual opportunity arises.

 

[SimonG]

I have a 25 year old starting Monday, seems keen. only wants £100 per week. I am signing him up for 1 year initially with a pay review in 6 months. If he tidies my van and cleans my work space I will be happy. there wont be much for him to do most of the time but gives me someone to talk to, can get the radio out the van (which I forget most of the time) and hopefully give me more time to think rather then going to the van and smoking so much!!

I hope you have a get out clause if he turns out to be cack after the first week!

 

[SimonG]

In fact the more I read of this thread the less likely I am to take an apprentice on So I'll leave it there.

 

[ExArmy]

I hope you have a get out clause if he turns out to be cack after the first week!

you can sack them at any time, with good reason.

 

[wetdrip]

you could always get another one! but seriously, this does and could happen, but not really that likely to happen if you take on a 16 year old, when they are time served they will be 20, at that age you think they are going to WANT to set up on their own? let alone have the money to set up on their own? i wouldn;t worry too much about that

At last the voice of reason.
Having gone through many an old thread on here all about taking on an apprentice; which ALL of you were at one point or another.Be it under a time severed journeyman or under a fast track plumbing/gas course teacher/tutor.

The conclusion drawn is: many seem to think they're taking on some sub-species.

I can honestly say, I'd drop many a thread contributor down a hole so deep they'd die of thirst before they hit the bottom.

 

[SimonG]

At last the voice of reason.
Having gone through many an old thread on here all about taking on an apprentice; which ALL of you were at one point or another.Be it under a time severed journeyman or under a fast track plumbing/gas course teacher/tutor.

The conclusion drawn is: many seem to think they're taking on some sub-species.

I can honestly say, I'd drop many a thread contributor down a hole so deep they'd die of thirst before they hit the bottom.

Voice of reason my backside.

So how much plumbing do you do wetdrip?, how many apprentices you taken on? or is it purely based on the fact that your son is looking for an apprenticeship.

Too much sour grapes about plumbers no taking on apprentices as though it's a god given requirement that they need to put something back into the 'plumbing industry'. Well what a load of bull.

If I was going to take somebody on then I would prefer a 30 year old 'apprentice' than a spotty 16 year old oik that has to have his mobile phone surgically removed every morning.

As for dropping posters down a well, well forum rules prevent me from commenting on such a brainless comment.

 

[wetdrip]

Voice of reason my backside.

So how much plumbing do you do wetdrip?, how many apprentices you taken on? or is it purely based on the fact that your son is looking for an apprenticeship.

Too much sour grapes about plumbers no taking on apprentices as though it's a god given requirement that they need to put something back into the 'plumbing industry'. Well what a load of bull.

If I was going to take somebody on then I would prefer a 30 year old 'apprentice' than a spotty 16 year old oik that has to have his mobile phone surgically removed every morning.

As for dropping posters down a well, well forum rules prevent me from commenting on such a brainless comment.

I rest my Case.

 

[SimonG]

I rest my Case.

Just as well.

 

[Dotty]

Play nice or I'll close the thread.......

 

[SimonG]

Well it's like a witch hunt, can't come on begging for themselves or sons to be taken on and then have a go at the people who are in the position to do that, just because they don't.

I'm running a business not a charity, everybody's in the same boat. Maybe if the industry was blossoming and work was coming out yer ears then yes. But the market is saturated with people who have been filled with dreams of easy work for 70 -100k a year.

I feel sorry for the youngsters coming out of school with a real passion for a trade and commitment to make it work. But it doesn't make good business sense, for me, to take somebody on.

It's just a shame that some individuals are too short sighted to see that, and then comments about chucking posters down wells because they have a different view, well, spat dummy, toys out of pram etc fit very nice.

 

[wetdrip]

Well it's like a witch hunt, can't come on begging for themselves or sons to be taken on and then have a go at the people who are in the position to do that, just because they don't.

I'm running a business not a charity, everybody's in the same boat. Maybe if the industry was blossoming and work was coming out yer ears then yes. But the market is saturated with people who have been filled with dreams of easy work for 70 -100k a year.

I feel sorry for the youngsters coming out of school with a real passion for a trade and commitment to make it work. But it doesn't make good business sense, for me, to take somebody on.

It's just a shame that some individuals are too short sighted to see that, and then comments about chucking posters down wells because they have a different view, well, spat dummy, toys out of pram etc fit very nice.

In my time I've had around 12 -15 apprentices.Which is 12-15 more than yourself
As far as you being in a position to do something for me/us.
I think not.
You most certainly do not have the temperament to take any apprentice under your wing.
You come across on here as too poisonous.Let me qualify that last statement for you and admin. At no time were you ever singled out by me.
I stated while going through OLD threads.That's using the search on the forum.
So the question you have to ask yourself is: why did you reply so vehemently to my post.
The answer to that is , by your posts, obvious to all.