Business studies for plumbers?

[Ray Stafford]

Hi Everyone

I often see stuff on this forum, and on Facebook, where tradesmen are seeking general business advice - rather than trade related advice.

Or coming from a different angle, over 50% of businesses fail in the their first few years.

I have spent nearly 30 years watching tradesmen set up businesses, and I am convinced that a large percentage of those that fail are not because the tradesman is bad at plumbing, its because they are bad at business.

Business skills are no different from any other set of skills - it take time and training to acquire them. Despite what you might read about Steve Jobs or Bill Gates, no-one is born with those skills, any more than people are born knowing how to solder.

However, it is notoriously difficult to get tradesmen into a classroom. Quite often one of the things that attracted them to the trade in the first place was to get out of the classroom!

The topics I am thinking about include:

Business planning
Marketing
Cost management
Pricing
Financing your business
Regulatory issues
Sales & Negotiation
Basic contract and consumer law
Basic book-keeping
Basic employment law
Managing staff and sub-contractors
dealing with VAT

All this can be found, but only by reading books or going on courses that are aimed at all types of businesses, so you have to plough through loads of irrelevant crap to find the stuff relevant to plumbers. I am contemplating something aimed purely at plumbers and heating engineers, although I imagine it wouldn't need much tweaking to make it work for Sparkies or Tilers.

If such training were to be made available, would you be interested, now or in the future?

If you would be interested, what form should it take? Evenings, weekends, daytimes? How long in each block? How far would you be prepared to travel? How much would you be willing to pay (if anything)?

See poll above, but am also interested in people's thoughts in general.

 

[SimonG]

Always keen on finding better or easier ways of doing things.

 

[SimonG]

Distance learning?

 

[Chalked]

Done.


The trouble with most small plumbing/ building firms, ( me included) is 1. Making time to learn these finer points of running a business. And 2. We all say we're rubbish at certain sports, but. Nobody will admit they are a a bad driver, a bad parent, or a poor businessman. But all can be helped with training.

 

[Ray Stafford]

We all say we're rubbish at certain sports, but nobody will admit they are a a bad driver, a bad parent, or a poor businessman.

This is so true.

 

[lame plumber]

I think Ray has hit the nail on the head here, so many tradesman I know are happy with low hourly rates, yet they have never sat down and worked out their fixed costs, and added that to the salary they want and included holidays and downtime etc. Tis no wonder so many flounder and give up, telling the world they cant beat poles charging a tenner an hour. Nope you cant beat them, you dont bother trying, you just set your sights higher, build a business plan and then monitor it. Simple really, just a shame no one teaches people the basics. I got taught all of this at agricultural college as part of the overall course, it was considered to be the most important part of the HND course!! all I remember is cash flow is king, turnover means b all if you dont get a decent net profit. well done Ray

 

[Deleted member 25704]

60% of businesses go bust in the first year and 80% have failed in three years

I think we could all do with a bit of what Ray is suggesting.

I undertook some business training about ten years ago and wished that I had done it 30 years ago. Things like the 80-20 rule (you make 80% of your profit from 20% of your customers) is worth learning, and it helped me to focus on my existing clients in terms of better service rather than wasting time responding to strangers to give extensive quotes. The small jobs became important because clients were won and their trust gained...bigger jobs followed, along with word of mouth recommendation.

 

[Riley]

I'd be very interested to know what you've got in mind Ray

 

[PlumbBobBob]

I'd be very interested to know what you've got in mind Ray

as would I, sounds interesting

 

[Masood]

Very interested. Would prefer a class rather than distance learning as I'd be much more disciplined about turning up. It's too easy to procrastinate when studying at home...

2 - 3 hours one or maximum two evenings a week would probably work best for me in practice, but obviously might not suit everyone.

 

[JCSPLUMBING]

I'd definitely be interested.trouble is with tradesman, especially sole traders is that we ain't got a fecking clue how to market properly. Marketing skills is key.

 

[thompsonbrown]

60% of businesses go bust in the first year and 80% have failed in three years

I think we could all do with a bit of what Ray is suggesting.

I undertook some business training about ten years ago and wished that I had done it 30 years ago. Things like the 80-20 rule (you make 80% of your profit from 20% of your customers) is worth learning, and it helped me to focus on my existing clients in terms of better service rather than wasting time responding to strangers to give extensive quotes. The small jobs became important because clients were won and their trust gained...bigger jobs followed, along with word of mouth recommendation.

60% first year 80% next 3yrs that's 140% out of 100%.
Picked it up so quick as I do all my own bookkeeping.
Do I need need business skill training?

 

[Ray Stafford]

60% of businesses go bust in the first year and 80% have failed in three years

60% first year 80% next 3yrs that's 140% out of 100%.

Errr no.

If 60% went bust in year 1, and then 10% went bust in year 2 and another 10% went bust in year 3, then Clangers statement would be completely accurate.

Picked it up so quick as I do all my own bookkeeping. Do I need need business skill training?

Looks like it!

On a serious note, the figures quoted by Clanger are a bit out of date, and the picture has improved somewhat in recent years, but they are still pretty awful.

 

[Radioman]

I used to teach this stuff to a different trade as a consultant, but there really is no basic difference in practice. I am now retired from my own operation but would be up for helping out with the lectures etc. I would think classroom based, either Saturday morning or afternoon spread over a few weekends with the modules broken up into categories.

 

[Radioman]

Part 1 pricing an estimate

 

[dave1]

I would be interested in this, depending where it's based obviously. Evenings or Saturdays would suit me best.

 

[Ric2013]

I'm reasonably useless at business, will admit it.

 

[leethegasman]

I think it is a very good idea Ray,I know this is a area that most of us tradesman would benefit from.
I personally would like the idea of the full day or days meeting up with say a group of twelve.and then followed up with distance learning and then meeting back up with the same group say 12 months etc down the line to see the benefits it's made on are life which it would.
I see this kind of thing more beneficial to a Bussiness and time should be made by tradesmen, but with tradesmen they just probably will not see the long term benefits and just look at it as spending time and money on something they don't need ?

 

[Ric2013]

I much prefer the full days idea voiced above. Evenings are great, but not when it's 100 miles to anywhere. Travel would just get far too expensive.

 

[erion]

This would be beneficial for a lot of people. You should look at making it into videos is well because some people haven't got the time to take off work.

 

[leethegasman]

This would be beneficial for a lot of people. You should look at making it into videos is well because some people haven't got the time to take off work.

You say that this would be beneficial for a lot of us and that is one of the major problems a lot of us look at it if we are not charging a customer we are not working and the fact of the matter is most of us are not running a business because we don't have that skill set And put time aside to do this because it feels like you are not being paid for it.and I think ray has picked up on that through dealing with his customers.
I personally think you have to make time to get involved in what ray may be proposing as I think it would make a big difference to the way you would run a Bussiness.
Looking forward to Ray's future posts on this

 

[mutley racers]

I am totally up for this. Would really help me out as I am shyte at it and really hate paperwork. Another benefit would get the wife off me ack asking if I have done this quote that quote and left this many busines cards at each job.

 

[Ray Stafford]

I'm working on it...

 

[lame plumber]

I'm working on the profit margins...

being a good merchant

 

[markadams]

I have always been impressed by the business/marketing advice that Ray gives in his posts. I would certainly welcome a good business/marketing course.

Mark.

 

[fubar1000]

Is there any update of this post lads?

I'd be very interested in learning some business skills. Tbh I'm dog dirt at all of that side of things lol

 

[Ray Stafford]

Is there any update of this post lads?

Hi Fubar

We're looking at different methods of training delivery, as it may not be convenient for some people to take time away from work and come to one location.

Just like you guys though, I have to fit this around the day job!

Ray