Epic post! upgrade of super old system....advice please...will include photos

[Sentry1]

Hi all,

We have recently moved in to an old victorian semi detached property with an old heating and hw system.

This consists of an old, currently short cycling Glowworm economy 50 f (i think) boiler in the kitchen connected to a pump, hw cylinder and 2 open tanks in the airing cupboard in the bathroom on the first floor. There are 10 radiators (two of which are newer and in the basement). I recently removed the hall rad to allow the plasterer access.There are only a couple of thermostatic valvs on the radiators.

The only control is a timer on the boiler and...get this...a manual valve to choose between heating the hot water or the central heating. No thermostat and no way of efficiently heating hot water only when it gets cooler or heating the house only when it drops below a certain temp. There is a water temp thermostat on the boiler but i'm not convinced this makes much difference. All we can do it have the boiler on...or off!

There is a power shower pump attached to the cyclinder powering one shower.

Some advice required if possible for the following things

• i want to have much greater control over the operation of the central heating but without affecting the hot water supply. In my previous house i installed a wireless thermostat which was great but of course we didn't have the added complication of a hot water tank there.
• we are going to convert the loft this year...i dont want to spend loads on the heating if i'm going to change it all very soon anyway
• ideally i want good powerful showers in the original bathroom, in the new attic bathroom and potentially in a little ensuite in the basement.
• i would quite like to remove the need to have a hot water cylinder as i think this is perhaps a really inefficient way to use hot water. Please educate me on this...previously i had a combi boiler...water was heated as and when required and no earlier!
• Another reason to remove the tanks would be to free up more space in the original bathroom for a stand up shower
• We clearly will need a new boiler and are keen to reposition this elsewhere in the house (whether the new oneis combi or otherwise) . Is this possible? Perhaps the loft?
• the boiler was previously kettling and i fixed this with some sentinel x200 concentrate. Following some removal and replacement of radiators by the plumbers, this has returned along with a load of other noises.

So, considering all this, i have the following questions please please please!

• what do you think we should do in the short, medium and long term? i.e. what would a fisrt step be in controlling the heating better? We have a new six day old baby so temperature is even more important now! Happy to spend a little even if it will not be used later (eg 40 quid for a new wireless thermostat)
• Should we plan to get a combi?
• Are electric showers much better now? I.e. more power! Less noise! If so, examples would be great!
• if you think we should still have a cylinder, could this be placed in the eaves of a loft conversion?
• finally...how do i stop my boiler short cycling so much? I.e. on and off at least nce per minute, if not more.

Any help and thoughts on our situation would be terrific please!

Many thanks,

Pete

 

[gas46]

hi pete
no good news im afraid when you change boiler combi sounds like best option as heating /hot water would all need to moved into loft area if you are wanting to do conversion on loft,boiler cycling is most probably restriction in system/heat exchanger manual diverter valves are more common than you would think but quite often are found on single pipe systems which would add to the cycling problem especially if you have trv,s fitted other option would be unvented cylinder but me thinking you are going to need a full system which ever way you go you could add a stat but dont think you see much benifit from it hope this helps regards darren

 

[SafeGasInstall]

i will say get a local heating engineer to survey your home and he will be able to explain best all options !
i would say if have more then one bathroom go for a system boiler and unvented cylinder , or oversized combination boiler

 

[Sentry1]

Thanks for your replies so far gas46 and safegasinstall. Yes, it wil be quite a job. I have an engineer coming soon and i'm hoping to understand a little more about the options before he/she does.

What about the point about electric showers? Are they better now than they were? Plus are the good ones ridiculously expensive?

 

[SafeGasInstall]

You could have a shower in the loft and have a combi boiler installed !
If you get elect shower you can benefit from it as a back up should comby pack up !
But first ting first is to find out what is your mains cold water supply like volume of water and pressure ! Then you will know if you could have a combi installed and electric shower !
Cost of all components very and is up to you how much you are willing to spent on shower and full central heating replacement !

 

[mountainman]

If your thinking about multiple electric showers then you need to consult a spark to determine if your incoming supply is adequate for the potential load.
I personally have always been a fan of unvented cylinders for multiple shower installations, but of course you may have to increase the size of your incoming cold water main.
MM

 

[Sentry1]

Thanks mountainman, very good point. The pressure is very good but i will obviously get it checked out. The electricity s pretty old and may need to upgrade when doing the loft anyway.

Could the combi be sited anywhere in theory? I with they could be installed externally as they can be massive!