Faulty Boiler - who is to blame?

[gillykms]

Hi,

I bought my first home last year and have had no real problems with it until last week there was a knock on my door and it was the fire brigade! I had just had my oil tank filled up that day and had switched on my heating which was the first time really since the start of the year. A neighbour reported that they could see black smoke coming out of my garden and when they came to investigate it, it was coming from my boiler. They advised me not to turn my heating on again until the boiler had been serviced.

The person who serviced my boiler has now told me that the boiler that is installed is not correct or is illegal. There is a sticker on it which says August 2007 and I also have paperwork from buying my home which says it was replaced in 2007. The problem is that he said the boiler is a grade C when it should have been replaced with a grade A. He also says that the burner and the boiler do not match and that it looks like just the shell of the boiler was replaced not the boiler itself. (Sorry I can't provide anymore technical information but hopefully that will make sense to someone out there!) He said that although I am able to use it, it will need serviced more regularly than an energy efficient bolier and also it will be using more oil than an energy efficient one. He also has said that when I come to sell my home I will need to replace the boiler first before I can sell it?

So basically it would appear that whoever replaced the boiler did so wrongly, perhaps they knew they did it wrong or perhaps they just weren't trained properly. The person that serviced my boiler seems to think that someone should be liable for this and I should get some compensation but I'm sure its alot trickier than this.

I could contact the people who used to live here but I'm sure its not their fault and also I'm sure they would not have a receipt of who replaced the boiler the last time therefore there is no way of proving who carried out the work even if they did remember who it was.

I have also been advised to contact the estate agent who sold me the house as they would have been responsible for organising the Energy Performance Certificate to be carried out and whoever done this should have picked up on the problems with the boiler - therefore could they be liable?

I do not have the EPC myself and contacted my solicitor who said that the mortgage lender would have it with the title deeds but if I wanted to request a copy they could well charge me £50 or so for it. He also said that the EPC doesn't effect the value of my home, 'it is what it is' is what he said and when I do go to sell my home it can be shown to possible buyers and they can decide whether or not they want to live in a possibly less energy efficient home. If I don't replace the boiler will I have to pass on the problems I know about it to a future buyer?

And to end this....is there any way I could claim off my house insurance for a new boiler in this situation??

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Dotty]

can you give us a few more details on the boiler and the burner please Gilly?

 

[tamz]

Sounds to me like the service guy is doing a bit of scaremongering.

From April 2007 it was mandatory to fit band A or B oil boilers but there was a lead in period allowing work signed up before that date to be fitted after.
Non condensing boilers can still be fitted today providing an assessment is carried out and certain criteria met.

It is highly unlikely (although not impossible) your boiler was a "shell" fitted with the older burner. Some more information would be helpful on this. The make and model of the boiler will be on the case or inside the door and the burner type will be on the burner itself. The boiler may be something like a Warmflow 50/70 and the burner a Riello RDB. This is perfectly normal. If you are not sure post up a picture.

Your boiler should not require servicing any more than a band A or B and the savings in running costs would be less than you are led to believe. A band C is from 82 - 86% efficient, a band B, 86 - 90 % and a band A above 90%. Do the sums for yourself. All oil boilers should be serviced annually regardless of the banding.

When it comes to selling your house do you really think it will be a problem? No one mentioned a problem to you when you bought it.

As far as your title goes, Faulty boiler, who is to blame, i'm afraid it is you, as the only "fault" seems like a lack of a service.
Your home insurers will not pay for a service.

 

[Dotty]

Wee bit harsh at the end there Tamz mate, but you're right. If there was any issue at all with the boiler being a band C (which i doubt because I can usually get a conventional oil boiler to sit happily in the 88-92% range!) then it would've been highlighted in the HIP which Gilly should have got.

The boiler guy is chancing his arm though!

 

[tamz]

Wee bit harsh at the end there Tamz mate,

I know .Just saying it as i read it

 

[Tong]

Hi,

The person who serviced my boiler has now told me that the boiler that is installed is not correct or is illegal. There is a sticker on it which says August 2007 and I also have paperwork from buying my home which says it was replaced in 2007. The problem is that he said the boiler is a grade C when it should have been replaced with a grade A
He also says that the burner and the boiler do not match and that it looks like just the shell of the boiler was replaced not the boiler itself. (Sorry I can't provide anymore technical information but hopefully that will make sense to someone out there!) He said that although I am able to use it, it will need serviced more regularly than an energy efficient bolier and also it will be using more oil than an energy efficient one. He also has said that when I come to sell my home I will need to replace the boiler first before I can sell it?

Just to take each point above .. having a grade C boiler is not illegal and it is not compulsory to change it to a new grade a boiler unless of course you wish to do so. One would assume that it was the burner that was changed in 2007 and the age of the shell of the boiler is unknown .. The matter of the mismatch between boiler shell and burner is not really a problem as it is common to replace a worn out burner with a new one and leave the shell in place and provided that the burner is of a suitable rating for the boiler and the installer was OFTEC registered then perfectly legal.
It may be true that it is necessary to service an older burner more regularly to keep it in peak performance but the same is also true of newer boilers. It is not true to say that you will have to replace the boiler prior to selling the property!!

So basically it would appear that whoever replaced the boiler did so wrongly, perhaps they knew they did it wrong or perhaps they just weren't trained properly. The person that serviced my boiler seems to think that someone should be liable for this and I should get some compensation but I'm sure its alot trickier than this.

I could contact the people who used to live here but I'm sure its not their fault and also I'm sure they would not have a receipt of who replaced the boiler the last time therefore there is no way of proving who carried out the work even if they did remember who it was.

I have also been advised to contact the estate agent who sold me the house as they would have been responsible for organising the Energy Performance Certificate to be carried out and whoever done this should have picked up on the problems with the boiler - therefore could they be liable?

I do not have the EPC myself and contacted my solicitor who said that the mortgage lender would have it with the title deeds but if I wanted to request a copy they could well charge me £50 or so for it. He also said that the EPC doesn't effect the value of my home, 'it is what it is' is what he said and when I do go to sell my home it can be shown to possible buyers and they can decide whether or not they want to live in a possibly less energy efficient home. If I don't replace the boiler will I have to pass on the problems I know about it to a future buyer?

The energy performance assessor is not responsible for identifying boiler problems nor is required by the regulations to do so!

And to end this....is there any way I could claim off my house insurance for a new boiler in this situation??

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

I assume that the person you called to rectify the original fault has done so and did not condemn the boiler if so then I suggest you stop looking for scapegoat's and have the boiler serviced regularly as you have been advised .. if the burner was replaced in 2007 it should have many years of life left as long as the boiler shell lasts anyway!

 

[moony]

its a bit like buying a twenty year old car - and then trying to claim off the car insurance cos its old and inefficient - they will just tell you if you want a new efficient model go buy one.

the engineer here has in my opinion used his best selling techniques to A get you to buy a new boiler or B to service it more than you need to to gain more money. Either way its your choice if you want a more efficient boiler then get one - it will help you when selling but wont be a legal requirment - or keep the one youve got (no harm imo in this probably just needed a service) if you do come to sell they will do a epc on your house and the potential buyers will know what they are buying as you did when buying - unless the epc check did not show this in which case your blame could go on the person carrying out the epc check.

 

[tackleburger]

The service engineer is a chancer by the sound of it. First of all he says it's illegal, then the burner and boiler don't match. Now if that were the case which i doubt. Why did he then let you continue to use it? He's trying to sell you a new boiler simple as that. Get someone else to do it every year and don't forget.

 

[oldplumber]

you cant blame the epc guy or gal as all they do is ask the current owner what type of boiler they have in the house to input into their computer programme. I had one done recently and he happily guessed my combi was a band b and didnt bother inputting the aga in the corner guzzling all that gas as the computer doesnt have an input for agas!!!!!!!!!!!! so my inefficient old pile got a epc rating of c with an improvement of 5% if i change a few lamps. what a total waste of time and money.

 

[Tong]

you cant blame the epc guy or gal as all they do is ask the current owner what type of boiler they have in the house to input into their computer programme. I had one done recently and he happily guessed my combi was a band b and didnt bother inputting the aga in the corner guzzling all that gas as the computer doesnt have an input for agas!!!!!!!!!!!! so my inefficient old pile got a epc rating of c with an improvement of 5% if i change a few lamps. what a total waste of time and money.

The energy assessor is required to identify the main source of heating in the property and would not do this by word of mouth .. he/she would refer to the SEDBUK database after noting the make and model of the boiler .. if unable to fully identify the boiler a generic term could be entered with the age and type of the boiler. The database does include AGA brand boilers and if this is the main source for heating the property then it should have been noted as such. If the AGA is for hot water only then it also should have been noted as such. If you are not satisfied with the EPC that has been produced for your property then there is an extensive complaints system beginning with the body with whom the assessor is registered and this can be identified on the EPC itself.

 

[HoodedClaw]

If you did want it changed I think you can still get the £400 government grant to get an efficient one. But if its working why worry - should be serviced yearly and when you come to sell the house heating isn't part of and survey - they specifically don't test to see if heating and hw is working..