Long time issue re ferroli boiler, gas meter, high bills and thermostat....

[Jogon]

Hello everyone, first post, am am a consumer not a plumber.

My issues are these....

Live in a four bed house, there are 13 rads in the house, most are double panel double convector, room sizes are above average.

Every rad has a thermostaic rad valve (Drayton)

6 of the rads are on their lowest setting and as such give out no heat (they are in rooms that are not used) leaving 7 in use of which 5 are on full, two are at 3 .

Boiler is a Ferroli Maxima Combi less than 5 years old (just) but I've had enough of it and is coming out just as soon as I find somone that wants to take it out for me..

I have a brand new Valiant ECOTEC 837 to go in, has been sitting in the garage for a year, it's still sealed etc..

On average we are using between 15 and 20 untils on our gas meter each day but we only have the boiler on between 12 and 15 hours (in this weather..cold) and less than that if the temp comes up. The result is bills around the £800 mark which is just unacceptable.

The house is well insulated, we never have the thermostat above 21 and the boiler temp is set at 72 (goes to 75)

Why are our bills so high? We only have a gas hob , and the seven rads in use, most peoples houses I go to are like saunas and with their thermostats at 23+.

Is the gas meter faulty? Is the ferroli just not as efficient as it states (ceebuk rated a).

We don't know what to do but we cannot sustain the £800 bills for 2x quarters a year.

We have tried the thermostat in most rooms, not sure which is the best to do, currently it's in our bedroom which is the ropom least visited during the day and maintains a temp when the heating is on at around 21 ...so the room temp should switch the wireless theromstat on and off which it seems to etc...

What are we doing wrong? what can we do to try and rectify it? where do we get the gas meter tested etc.

We have a Mira Platinum shower, used daily for no more than ten mins between us all, it works off the boiler....even the shower has started to go cold from the 42 it's set at (can go up to 49) so not sure the Ferroli can cope with it and why it has started to go cold less than a year since it's fitting...


Any advice would be good.

Thankyou

 

[ecowarm]

Welcome to the forum, someone on here may be able to pop round and have a look for you, where are you?

 

[Jogon]

Was just updating profile, I'm on the outskirts of Ashby De La Zouch in Leicestershire

 

[shaky]

Drop me a pm if your stuck

 

[midge]

On average we are using between 15 and 20 untils on our gas meter each day

Hi Jogon, What units are we talking about more precisely? kW, Cu metres or Cu ft

I have a 2 bed semi detached bungalow and during this cold weather I'm using about 10 Cu metres a day. Yes it is expensive. Very difficult to generalise but I have many customers with annual fuel bills (Gas and electric combined) in excess of £1500.

 

[stevetheplumber]

wish i could afford to run heating 12 to 15 hours a day 2 hours in morning and 5 at night for us if its cold put a sweat shirt on

 

[Jogon]

Hello Midge, the Gas Meter is a simple 5 digit meter, Enclosed is an attachment of it, it currently says 16802, a typical day with this weather and it would read between 16817 to 16822 (15 to 20m units)

---

stevetheplumber, the house is populated in the day and there is a new born and an under 5, keeping the heating on in this weather is how it is. Feel free to answer the technical questions i raised though, I wont mind a bit.

 

[Jogon]

Midge, the electric bill here runs at around £135 per quart which isn't so bad considering the appliances on at any one time., the gas bill last year was £1600

 

[dancinplumba]

where is your roomstat ? is it in a room with trv on the radiator ?

 

[SimonG]

I think stevetheplumber was trying to say that gas boilers run on gas not fresh air. If your using it then you have to pay for it. The numbers you quote all tally up for me.

One technical point, get the stat out of the bedroom, especially if set to 21.

 

[dancinplumba]

when you say well insulated, do you have cavity wall insulation ? how much loft insulation do you have ?

 

[dancinplumba]

as simon sez bedrooms are 18 not 21

 

[Jogon]

Yes it is in a room where a TRV is and Smon, where would you suggest it goes and set at and for what reason? ( I need to udnerstand)

 

[Jogon]

Cavity wall yes, Loft insulation is above the recommended amount (thickness) house is double glazed, windows are not as large as some, no patio doors.

 

[dancinplumba]

should be in a room where there is no trv they conflict and roomstat will not turn your boiler off remove trv head

 

[dancinplumba]

and pref a room with no other heat source, if hallway set stat to 18

 

[SimonG]

Yes it is in a room where a TRV is and Smon, where would you suggest it goes and set at and for what reason? ( I need to udnerstand)

In a room with no trv. If the trv turns off the rad before the stat reaches 21 then your boiler will continue to run until boiler stat satisfied.

Try the 10 second test on your rads when hot. If you can pinch the rad between thumb and finger for 10 seconds then its fine. If you can't do it for the full 10 seconds then get the boiler stat turned down.

 

[zzzjim]

( not a Plumber either ) Has shower performance , got worst with arrival of winter ? . Incoming water is much cooler !

Flow rate is needed to do any meaningful maths .

 

[Jogon]

would that then keep the heat in the house at 18 then? which would be a bit on the cold side in this weather?

 

[Jogon]

Yes Jim it has, the flowrate is beyond me or i'd have done it....the shower is the furtherst item from the boiler and there is approx 25 feet og pipework from the boiler to the shower, the platimum has a pre-heat facility so it starts, gets to the temp you set it at then switched off until you're ready to get in it at which point you switch it on (within a certain time of course) and away it goes. One of the reasons why I'm getting rid of the ferrolie is because the Ecottec has a better flow rate than the ferroli) marginal that it is...but the ferroli has given me enough problems over the years, it's got to go.

 

[dancinplumba]

would that then keep the heat in the house at 18 then? which would be a bit on the cold side in this weather?

ideally hall and bedrooms 18 and living rooms 21 if system designed correctly put stat in a living room and set to 21 also away from draughts and at a height of 1.2 to 1.5 m but rad should not have trv

 

[Jogon]

How do you take a trv off? It's a Chrome Dratyon one....do I simply hold the bottom part (large thread) and simply unscrew the top part and if so do i then put over one of those plastic caps?

 

[dancinplumba]

How do you take a trv off? It's a Chrome Dratyon one....do I simply hold the bottom part (large thread) and simply unscrew the top part and if so do i then put over one of those plastic caps?

juist unscrew it and leave it bare

 

[dancinplumba]

just to add, lofts should have minimum 270mm rockwool, and how old are your windows ? mine are 15 and not as efficient as new ones, you can get them 90% now, but as a short term remedy i have added clingfilm/shrink wrap to mine, easy to do and has improved the comfot level and no longer get condensation on bedroom windows. you can get kits off fleabay, hope this helps. Then you should insulate your floors lol

 

[stevetheplumber]

i8 degrees is 18 degres regardles of the weather but yes it probably wouldnt be warm enough

 

[tamz]

If you want the heat, no matter what the weather or whatever boiler is fitted you will pay for it. I like the house at 23 and the wife likes it on all day in this weather. My gas bills are £116/month (condensing boiler with 3 zones) which is working out about right.
Fitting the new boiler will drop your bills by perhaps 1 or 2 hundred per year. What you do need is a lesson on how to use and set it for the most economical running. Get someone in to show you if you can't figure it out.

 

[kirkgas]

If you want the heat, no matter what the weather or whatever boiler is fitted you will pay for it. I like the house at 23 and the wife likes it on all day in this weather. My gas bills are £116/month (condensing boiler with 3 zones) which is working out about right.
Fitting the new boiler will drop your bills by perhaps 1 or 2 hundred per year. What you do need is a lesson on how to use and set it for the most economical running. Get someone in to show you if you can't figure it out.

aye but your bills are so low cause you have a van full of old gas meters

 

[PlumbersMate]

how big is your house tamz? £116 a month sounds high to me for gas!!

 

[nickelarsed]

I'm just a trainee when it comes to heating so not really offering advice to the original post but if 6 of the rads are not in use, and a new boiler is getting installed would it not be good time to look at extra zoning at that point? I know it costs but if work is being done anyway it may not be too excessive and the boiler will still be heating that extra water and sending it round the pipes at the moment. Again asking as a question really to see what the more experienced here think.