Brains Required 4 black smoking GERKROS NEW boiler AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAargh!

[adaskins]

Any Brainiacs out there that can help, we have saved for 7 years to buy central heating (old house, falling, down, very,very rural, 2 kids, 10 dogs, 2 part time jobs!!!) Two weeks ago we bought everything required from ramsbottom oil suppliers, they recommended this Gerkros boiler its the cosyman. It ran for nearly two weeks then locked out, stinks the house out worse then everyones socks and wellies and is now billowing black smoke. The smell is just terrible, I would imagine hell had the sort of same acridity if there is such a word!! It will work if you clean the photoresistance rod which incidently is not in the manual, in fact the manual does not bear any resemblance to the boiler we have although we are assured by the supplier its the right one! After selling the trusty old rayburn to help with the funding of the heating we are all sitting here chittering, its back to the damp, cold and whisky, well the whisky part is okay it fair heats your cockles.....................................just off putting the electric blanket on there, gonna need it I fear. Had to open all the doors and windows to let the toxic fumes out, think the budgie has died! Oh, well any ideas guys and gals!! Nobody has heard of these boilers in our part of the woods and nobody wants to fix it and the supplier just garbles so much technical information to bamboozle you to the point that you forgot you were going to complain about the crapiness of the whole situatuation. Well will pour another whisky just for the potassium and hope your advice pours in through the site CHEERS

 

[migoplumber]

if it works when you clean the photo cell, then its safe to assume you have a lot of soot in the boiler. soot caused by poor combustion.
would suggest, blocked nozzle (assumed its correct nozzle in first place - each instalation is individually spec'd for correct nozzle size ) could be a blockage on the air intake side, or a dodgy oil pump.
ive never heard of that make either.
take a picture, search for a data plate on unit. more information needed im afraid.

 

[WHPES]

Gerkros were an Irish manufacturer which I am told closed down in 2009. I presume it must be second hand or old stock at a knock down price? Trouble is there is probably no support and you can't get spares. I have never seen one in England and wasn't aware that anyone imported them here. You won't get any instructions unless you manage to track down a technician with a copy or another owner. The company websites www.gerkros.ie and www.gerkros.co.uk are no longer active.

Is it a condensing boiler? My OFTEC book says the Cosyman isn't and is in the SEDBUK old, obsolete "c" band. If so you may have recourse to the seller and installer under the Building Regulations as they shouldn't have fitted it (contatct Building Control).

However it is usually mainly down to the burner rather than the boiler itself - What burner is fitted with it? My book says its the Riello RDB. If so it should be relatively simple to diagnose.

Don't be tempted to tinker with it yourself (dangerous and illegal) - get the original OFTEC registered installer back. Only a registered technician may install or work on an oil appliance. If it has only been installed for two weeks it is the responsibility of the installer to make sure it's right. If they won't sort it I suggest you contact Trading Standards.

The OFTEC website lets you search for local technicians.

Possible causes are:

1, insufficient air available -either inadequate ventilation to boiler, flue problems, poor flue design or air intal setting incorrect. (dangerous)

2, incorrect flue termination causing backdraughts down the flue etc (dangerous)

3, wrong nozzle

4, blocked filter, knackered fuel pump.

 

[justlead1]

Hi, Another option in line with previous posts is to contact the oil suppliers sales people, and ask if they would like to send a engineer round in order to keep the oil contract. Or find a supplier how will for your business. Good Luck

 

[adaskins]

if it works when you clean the photo cell, then its safe to assume you have a lot of soot in the boiler. soot caused by poor combustion.
would suggest, blocked nozzle (assumed its correct nozzle in first place - each instalation is individually spec'd for correct nozzle size ) could be a blockage on the air intake side, or a dodgy oil pump.
ive never heard of that make either.
take a picture, search for a data plate on unit. more information needed im afraid.

Thanks very much for the advice, I have searched for more info on the unit and it does appear to be 2007 it was made, so must be old stock, although was sold to me as new and was highly recommended by the supplier. You were spot on, it was the air intake that was the problem, got a friend of a pal of a neighbours, third cousin twice removed through drink to come and look at it. After three hours he said its a piece of junk, badly designed although he did fix it. I appreciate your advice and am going to take it up with the supplier who should have told us it is an old model and as the company is now bust how the heck can we get parts, we paid just under £800 for it so its not too cheap, including the fire valve, flue, thermostat etc it all came to £1600. Well another whisky to drown the pain of being conned I feel! Cheers tho for a quick reply and sound advice.

Cheers for the info, we were not told that this was a boiler from a bust company. We paid £1600 for the whol shebang including the flue kit, oil fire valve, thermostat etc. The boiler was not the model on the box it was delivered in and the Ramsbottom oil people keep telling us we got a good deal as the one we got is better than the one on the box! It is the burner you quoted and I will take this up with the seller, I appreciate your quick response and expert advice. Spot On

 

[migoplumber]

consider my back slapped, send beer to ......
happy to help, nice to have someine helped come back and tell us what the problem was. cheers

 

[WHPES]

If you paid by credit card you may be protected, especially if it was mis sold as being new and if is not a condensing boiler as all new boilers should be "A" rated if so does not comply with the Building Regualtions. The installer would also at fault as it should have been installed in line with Building Control. What does your statutory Building Control Notification sheet (green form) say on it?

Alternatively did the supplier install it? If they did you can report them to OFTEC. If they are an unregistered installer they will get into a LOT of trouble and you can definitely take it up with your credit card company.

I know it's a bit late now in your case, but ALWAYS do a bit of research when buying anything big.

The trouble is if it is non-condensing, it will cost more to run over the next couple of years than the difference in price between that and a more expensive Grant or Worcester Bosch unit.

 

[adaskins]

If you paid by credit card you may be protected, especially if it was mis sold as being new and if is not a condensing boiler as all new boilers should be "A" rated if so does not comply with the Building Regualtions. The installer would also at fault as it should have been installed in line with Building Control. What does your statutory Building Control Notification sheet (green form) say on it?

Alternatively did the supplier install it? If they did you can report them to OFTEC. If they are an unregistered installer they will get into a LOT of trouble and you can definitely take it up with your credit card company.

I know it's a bit late now in your case, but ALWAYS do a bit of research when buying anything big.

The trouble is if it is non-condensing, it will cost more to run over the next couple of years than the difference in price between that and a more expensive Grant or Worcester Bosch unit.

We fitted all the pipes radiators ourselves and had an OFTEC registered chap wire up and plumb in the boiler as the collins DIY manual was running out of info by then! We were sold the boiler as a condensing boiler but both plumbers have said its a combi, I have called Ramsbottom twice and they assured me it is not a combi, its a condensing. It certainly could be a condensing and is such a way out and weird make that nobody quite knows, its the Gerkros cosyman 14.6 - 20.5kx (50-90) with the riello burner you quoted. We did pay by a protected purchase card, simply incase we had any problems. I originally asked the supplier to quote for a Worcester and he assured me that all the boilers are now factory built from parts from China and are only assembled in Britain, therefore you are paying the extra for the name only and in essence the boilers are all the same internally. He told me the Irish boilers were of good quality being manufacted in Ireland, and as a supplier help, advice etc was on hand as part of the sale. Any technical advice and any help as a small family run business, (I am sure he said they have been trading 23 years) was part of the service. They were helpful and spent a lot of time on the phone discussing what we needed in full. I am angry that they have supplied us with this old stock from a bust company after saving for so long to get it done, another couple of hundred would have given us a boiler that people have heard of. Incidently a friend of mine who is Irish has never heard of the make but was slightly reassuring in that he told me there is no main line gas in Ireland so any boiler from there must be Good! Lol. Well am off to write to ramsbottom and will phone the credit card company too and get their advice. Ta much again for your advice will stay of the whisky now!

 

[WHPES]

You are getting confused - a combi or a system boiler can both be (and should be) also a condensing boiler. An easy way to tell - does it have a condensate drain from the boiler to take water away. See also

Gerkros Boilers %28Tipperary%29 Limited Boilers Details for Boiler Scrappage Scheme

The 14.6 according to the sheet IS a condensing boiler so you should be OK. If it is a combi you won't have a copper cylinder or a header tank in the loft.

A system boiler has a copper cylinder and a header tank.

Make sure your OFTEC guy has notified the Building Control Dept of the instalation as this is a legal requirement.

For £800 you've probably not done too bad. It's just over 1/2 the price of a Grant. Most of the controls and stats will be the same as other makes and readily available, all the burner parts are Riello and readily available. Other parts such as baffles and fittings can usually be made up specially if necessary though this can be expensive. If it's working ON now I would probably leave it as is but still write to the supplier complaining that you think they have misled you.

My personal preference is Grant boilers - British made throughout, good spares dept and friendly, helpful customer service.