Crumbling walls

[nysk2008]

Hi all,

Im sure alot of you have gone to do a boiler change before, taken the old boiler off of the wall and realised the wall is either not plumb or the plaster is crumbling. I was curious what material you generally use to hang the new boiler on if this is the case and the cust dont want to get the wall sorted.

Cheers

 

[Dannypipe]

In the past I have had to repair crumbling lath and plaster walls. I have used a sheet of 12mm ply, and on top of that TWO layers of 12.5mm plasterboard.

Remember the plaster board is needed for fire protection. Don't do it and get inspected and you may have to take the boiler off the wall.

PS, you can pack the ply to get it more plumb.

 

[nysk2008]

Cheers Danny - would you go for fire board or standard pasterboard on the ply?

 

[Pcplumb]

In the past I have had to repair crumbling lath and plaster walls. I have used a sheet of 12mm ply, and on top of that TWO layers of 12.5mm plasterboard.Remember the plaster board is needed for fire protection. Don't do it and get inspected and you may have to take the boiler off the wall.PS, you can pack the ply to get it more plumb.

This is how we have done it in the past with gyproc plasterboard. Just used the normal stuff as it's still fire resistant

 

[EPH]

GSR have told me ply is suitable for new boiler installs

 

[sparky]

Often use supalux if boiler is installed on stud walls. Mi's will say its ok without if local building authority ok it, but often the inspector will want to see supalux. Masonary walls not a problem.

 

[stevetheplumber]

very long screws and gripfil

 

[cjg]

stud and fireboard the way to go.

 

[Marky90]

very long screws and gripfil

Why waste money on screws 🙂 just joking before i get my head ripped off

 

[tackleburger]

In the past I have had to repair crumbling lath and plaster walls. I have used a sheet of 12mm ply, and on top of that TWO layers of 12.5mm plasterboard.

Remember the plaster board is needed for fire protection. Don't do it and get inspected and you may have to take the boiler off the wall.

PS, you can pack the ply to get it more plumb.

Don't know what boilers your fitting Danny but all the ones I use don't require fire protection and can be mounted straight on to ply. Check the MIs they will state what is required.

 

[AWheating]

Don't know what boilers your fitting Danny but all the ones I use don't require fire protection and can be mounted straight on to ply. Check the MIs they will state what is required.

the manufactures instructions may state it is safe to mount the boiler on a conbustable material, this does not mean that you can ignore building regulations in reguard to the type and material of the wall. If i remember building regs on timber framed buildings for example requires a superlux layer between boiler and wall to protect the wall, you would need permission off building control to not adhere to this.

the regulation is to do with the wall and not the boiler remember, no matter what the boiler is the wall may still need to adhere to these regs. I think is always good practice to do it anyways.

 

[tackleburger]

MIs overide these regulations in everycase. A stud wall already has a layer of platerboard. New builsa dont have supalux behind boilers just a dwang for the bolts.

 

[AWheating]

manufactures instructions only over ride regulations that concern the appliance, they do not over ride general building regulations. Ask the manufacture to put it in writing that your wall does not require a barrier. Most wont and will tell you you must speak to building control.

I have had this on plenty of new build housing sites especially timber framed, and we have always had to adhere to whatever building control says, normally we would follow the regs to save the hassle as its too late when the jobs finished and questions are still being asked. I have seen boilers removed and refitted with fire boarding behind because written permission was never agreed.

 

[Dannypipe]

Tackle, what does it cost to put two layers of plasterboard (or better still one layer of fire board) over the ply?

Less than a round at my local, and it's money well spent. There are a lot of things we could do to just comply when it wouldn't hurt to do a little bit more.

Besides the OP stated that he was struggling with a crumbling wall which was also way out of plumb. So I gave him a method to sort the wall, and comply.

 

[tackleburger]

manufactures instructions only over ride regulations that concern the appliance, they do not over ride general building regulations. Ask the manufacture to put it in writing that your wall does not require a barrier. Most wont and will tell you you must speak to building control.

I have had this on plenty of new build housing sites especially timber framed, and we have always had to adhere to whatever building control says, normally we would follow the regs to save the hassle as its too late when the jobs finished and questions are still being asked. I have seen boilers removed and refitted with fire boarding behind because written permission was never agreed.

The document that building regs will refer to is IGE/UP/7 I don't have a copy to hand but I think you'll find that document meets the current building standards. It states within that provided the Manufacturer states the appliance can be mounted on to a combustable surface there is no need for any additional thermal insulation on an outside wall of a timber framed dwelling. So MIs is what you would go with. The reason you are probably having to do what you say is because whoever is in charge doesn't know the rules so is playing it safe or the particular appliances were not suitable.

 

[tackleburger]

Tackle, what does it cost to put two layers of plasterboard (or better still one layer of fire board) over the ply?

Less than a round at my local, and it's money well spent. There are a lot of things we could do to just comply when it wouldn't hurt to do a little bit more.

Besides the OP stated that he was struggling with a crumbling wall which was also way out of plumb. So I gave him a method to sort the wall, and comply.

I'll continue to use 18mm ply Danny. Your method will be good too.

 

[tamz]

Here is the bit from IGE/UP/7 (i had to do it as a jpg as i can't copy the text without messing about with it)



Here in Scotland timber kit houses have been the standard new build since the late 70's so there is never much of a problem as they are well used to it.