Is circulating pump toast

[Madra Dana]

Having a problem with a pump associated with oil-fired-central heating. My Tuscon A circulating pump displays "E-" where normally it displays watts (5-45) used while pumping. Is it dead in the water so to speak. The Grant condenser boiler fired initially this morning but the pump never kicked in. I have checked that the pump impeller is rotating freely, but other than that I have no experience.

 

[tamz]

Never heard of a tuscon pump! If there is a big screw on the front of it remove it and put a small screwdriver in the hole. If it is spinning you will feel it.
Buy a grundfos next time.

 

[Dotty]

It's a smart pump Tam. 90 quids worth.

Probably toast.

 

[tamz]

Some pumps are not so smart tho :smile:

 

[Dotty]

not when they're dead ones.

 

[snowhead]

Tucson A-Rated Circulating Pump 6 Meter Head

Seems it's TUCSON and and made in the Republic? but also sold in the North?

 

[Madra Dana]

Thanks guys. Time to huddle around the fire.

 

[Madra Dana]

My mistake, it is that brand, but the cheaper 5m version.

 

[happyflyer]

Some pumps are not so smart tho :smile:

Tamz,

The pumps don't asked to be fitted, they are not that smart , the problem is the smart bum plumbers who fit them, just don't fit
smart pumps, how much energy is the World saving with this tosh? would you average householder notice a massive drop in energy
consumption after a new smart pump had been fitted, me thinks not.

 

[IDCHAPPY]

IMHO it's all a crock of crap, nothing wrong with the old 3 speed pumps, worked fine for 40 years.

 

[happyflyer]

IMHO it's all a crock of crap, nothing wrong with the old 3 speed pumps, worked fine for 40 years.

Chappy,

I wish everyone felt the same way, the idea probably started off in Europe, looked at what they have done to vacuum cleaner motors,
where will all this carp end.

I went to Russia in 1999 to do some Y2K testing for a big Bank, stood in Mac Donald's waiting to be served, looked at the long Russian names for a big Mac about 30 letters
in it, said bloody hell and a chap behind me said you OK, No I said glad you speak English, can you order for me, Yep no problem, I looked at the cost of the Meal
and it was about half the cost back in the UK, why is that I said, dead easy he said the customer dictates the cost of the product, if it was too high they won't
go in there, we ought to do that with pumps, don't buy them and they won't make them, no demand.

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Chappy,

I wish everyone felt the same way, the idea probably started off in Europe, looked at what they have done to vacuum cleaner motors,
where will all this carp end.

I went to Russia in 1999 to do some Y2K testing for a big Bank, stood in Mac Donald's waiting to be served, looked at the long Russian names for a big Mac about 30 letters
in it, said bloody hell and a chap behind me said you OK, No I said glad you speak English, can you order for me, Yep no problem, I looked at the cost of the Meal
and it was about half the cost back in the UK, why is that I said, dead easy he said the customer dictates the cost of the product, if it was too high they won't
go in there, we ought to do that with pumps, don't buy them and they won't make them, no demand.

I'm thinking of doing a bulk buy for some decent new old stock pumps. 3 speed fellys, nice and simple.

 

[Ray Stafford]

Yep no problem, I looked at the cost of the Meal
and it was about half the cost back in the UK, why is that I said, dead easy he said the customer dictates the cost of the product, if it was too high they won't
go in there, we ought to do that with pumps, don't buy them and they won't make them, no demand.

The cost of the ingredients is a trivially small part of the cost of a BigMac. By far the biggest costs in the fast food business are labour and property costs, both of which would have been significantly lower in Moscow in 1999 than in the West.

You can't just make up prices and charge what you like unless you have a completely unique product which people can't do without and there is no competition (like some utilities).

What the pump makers have done is lobby for a regulatory change which has been very much to their advantage. It happens all the time, and is one of the reasons for the creeping increase in various regulations. Economists have a term for it "rent-seeking". Its very much in the pump manufacturers interests to hire professional lobbyists to get the regulations adopted, but it there isn't a single group on the other side who have the money and motivation to hire lobbyists to make the opposing arguments.

 

[Best]

Idchappy, - there are B rated pumps still about made under the name Polaris & hopefully are decent. Huge saving especially in high head larger output ones compared with these A rated nonsense. Tucson pumps I have avoided to buy. They are made to look like Grundfoss, even in colour. Their ordinary non A rated older type were complete rubbish. I have seen them only being able to heat part of a heating system - even from brand new.

 

[quality]

The cost of the ingredients is a trivially small part of the cost of a BigMac. By far the biggest costs in the fast food business are labour and property costs, both of which would have been significantly lower in Moscow in 1999 than in the West.

You can't just make up prices and charge what you like unless you have a completely unique product which people can't do without and there is no competition (like some utilities).

What the pump makers have done is lobby for a regulatory change which has been very much to their advantage. It happens all the time, and is one of the reasons for the creeping increase in various regulations. Economists have a term for it "rent-seeking". Its very much in the pump manufacturers interests to hire professional lobbyists to get the regulations adopted, but it there isn't a single group on the other side who have the money and motivation to hire lobbyists to make the opposing arguments.

Thats one hell off an post, some experience in that answer

 

[happyflyer]

Idchappy, - there are B rated pumps still about made under the name Polaris & hopefully are decent. Huge saving especially in high head larger output ones compared with these A rated nonsense. Tucson pumps I have avoided to buy. They are made to look like Grundfoss, even in colour. Their ordinary non A rated older type were complete rubbish. I have seen them only being able to heat part of a heating system - even from brand new.

Best,

Who is selling them and better still who is buying them ???? They look the part, what do Grundfoss think, bet you can't copyright them, a pumps a pumps a pump!!!
Made in China like Land-Rover...

 

[happyflyer]

Ray,


It may well become self regulating when intelligent pumps don't last two mins in service, I was just making a simple case about Russia Supply and Demand, don't think it would ever work
in the UK we are all much too nice to even think of that one, some one will always go to Mc Donalds, but we do boycott a little in our own way, shopping for the cheapest petrol is an example
and someone is making these cheap pumps and someone is fitting them, they will only stop making them when there is no demand or they go bust.

Sounds from what you have said there may well be a pump cartel out there in some obscure way, covert price fixing by technical manipulation, etc, pumps have certainly gone up in price and Tuscon perhaps see a
gaping hole.

Landis once made a commercial optimiser which had a red led display, if you didn't touch it for about 10 mins it went off, clients would says it's faulty, but the Landis instructions said it was to save energy,
the display took about 1/2 a nano mA, smaller than a nit on a gnats nut.

Its called progress

 

[markfxy]

Chappy,

I wish everyone felt the same way, the idea probably started off in Europe, looked at what they have done to vacuum cleaner motors,
where will all this carp end.

I went to Russia in 1999 to do some Y2K testing for a big Bank, stood in Mac Donald's waiting to be served, looked at the long Russian names for a big Mac about 30 letters
in it, said bloody hell and a chap behind me said you OK, No I said glad you speak English, can you order for me, Yep no problem, I looked at the cost of the Meal
and it was about half the cost back in the UK, why is that I said, dead easy he said the customer dictates the cost of the product, if it was too high they won't
go in there, we ought to do that with pumps, don't buy them and they won't make them, no demand.

I'll have some of what your on mate what a load of waffle your spouting and don't believe all you read about Europe most of it's made up by the press, I suppose you feel you have to blame somebody and why not johnny foreigner after all we're the best in the world at everything aren't we:whatchutalkingabout

 

[Best]

Best,

Who is selling them and better still who is buying them ???? They look the part, what do Grundfoss think, bet you can't copyright them, a pumps a pumps a pump!!!
Made in China like Land-Rover...

Happyflyer, the Tucson standard old type pump that you use a photo of, has been sold over here in NI by a few merchants. My experience of the 5m Tucson pumps are that they are rubbish. I had assumed they were Chinese, so you could be right.
There are pumps under the brand Polaris which are currently sold here by some merchants & of all different types. They might be different. They are B rated & cost is very low. Long may they last.

 

[happyflyer]

Best,

The problems with domestic heating is is simple the customer thinks they should run forever, years gone by Opiomatic made a pump about 12" high and 6" in dia
built like a brick SH, they lasted for ever seen one run for 15 years and beyond, they ran with crap and magnetic material all their lives, no flushing or chemical
system additives then. When they stopped just take the top off clean all the carp out and re-assemble.

Progress and throw away today are Tuscon sold on this side the water I wonder, and if not why???

 

[Best]

Happyflyer, you are right, some of the old pumps were superb. I know of a circulating pump in a bungalow that is the original & is 1962! Still going perfectly & the system is dirty. Big brute of a thing compared with modern 130mm pumps.
The Tuscon pumps have been sold here from various merchants. I have only experience of the 5m versions & I would avoid them. I never used them but have seen them failing to pump fully, even brand new.
The Polaris pumps are being sold here & as far as I know it is okay to use them unless on new work.
Will pm you some details.