powerflushing Microbore

[keyte1]

Hi,

Can anyone give tips on the most effecient / effective way to powerflush a microbore heating system. If any of you have put together a procedure that is successful I would be grateful if you would share it!!

 

[villa_tom]

I wouldn't bother. I've done it once and never again. Popped about three joints and it never worked properly at all. Better off with a repipe of affected pipework and taking the rads off and manually flushing them.

 

[Brooster]

Sorry - I'm not a plumber so this is not my advice and I haven't got a clue what its talking about , but I came across an article on the proflush website about this (this won't let me post the URL but you can find the pdf on their website under images uploads powerflushing of microbore and singel pipe systems ... hope it's of use!

 

[negas]

never ever you spend more time having to find the blockages you have caused always repipe or just add a magna clean at worst

 

[keyte1]

Thankyou both for your replies I have heard a few horror stories about powerflushing microbore.

 

[kay-jay]

Heavy dose of cleaner in system for a couple of weeks before even contemplating a flush on microbore

 

[Guildfordboiler]

Ive done a fair few never had a problem and they all worked fine after
they take a lot longer to do and I double the dose of the chemical which is alway fx2 I have never pre treated a week before although i suppose it would help on the day

 

[Mike Jackson]

I've seen the result of someone powerflushing microbore. Took me 2 days to sort out, removing radiators and backflushing pipework to get it all working again. As was said above, a good chemical clean is the safest way.

 

[AWheating]

it can be done, but it has a higer risk of problems. make sure you get a full knowledge of the system condition, installation and pre warn customer of possible problems.

 

[keyte1]

Thanks for all responses


So far this be a fair summing up.


Consider carefully whether the jobwould be worthwhile.




When pricing the job make an allowancefor extra time and materials.
Also price for re piping. Inform thecustomer of the problems associated with power flushing a Microboresystem.and give the facts and the options available to them.




If both parties are happy to go ahead.


Double amount of system cleaner thatwould normally be use used of on similar sized regular system, andpre treat upto a couple of weeks before the powerflush .


Proflush website gave some useful tipon how to clear a blockage from a rad valve.
(Thankyou Brooster)


Can any body suggest any otherprecautions?

 

[Fishpond]

Personally I just do a chemical clean... power flushing microbore isn't worth the hassle.

I was with a customer a few months back and they said they saw something on the web about powder flushing for microbore (just found it here POWDERFLUSH ). Anyone heard about this?

 

[keyte1]

Personally I just do a chemical clean... power flushing microbore isn't worth the hassle.

I was with a customer a few months back and they said they saw something on the web about powder flushing for microbore (just found it here POWDERFLUSH ). Anyone heard about this?

I've heard of it, it's supposed to be more thorough but a more aggressive clean and on an old system is far more likely to cause leaks.

 

[PowderFlush]

Powder Flush was specifically designed to overcome the shortcomings power flushing has in cleaning microbore systems and I can assure you that it does NOT cause leaks and in fact causes less leaks because we don’t have to use strong acidic cleaners. The powder and pellets we use are by design, just hard enough to scrape of hardened sludge but not so hard that it can cause leaks or damage. We have various sized pellets of different densities depending on pipe size and age of the system we are cleaning. We have performed hundreds of procedures on microbore, both copper and plastic and have a much higher success rate than trying to power flush them. It is true that standard power flushing is not all that effective on microbore and it is true that Powder Flushing will get better results. We know this because around 50% of our work is on systems where power flushing has already failed to get results, at least once.

 

[newcastle phill]

Ill believe anything if its done in a controlled environment.
Ultimately both rely on getting the water to circulate.
Both will have there pros and cons.
Powder flushing has to be abrasive to a degree where chemicals arent so.
Probably a mixture of the two will give the best results

But being sceptical and cautious type.
I am always slow to believe what i am told by someone who has a vested interest in pushing something for gain

 

[Robert Tyrrell]

I've found that because microbore systems generally rely on the pigtail style manifold (Older systems) the sludge causes a blockage at that point where the pipe is reduced from 22mm to 10mm.
I don't use a 'Power flushing' machine but I do use an Adey Magna Cleanse machine because it uses the system pump and therefore cannot exert any more pressure than already applied to the system. I put the chemical cleaner in at least the day before and ask the customer to run both the heating and hot water for at least two hours immediately prior to my return visit.
Having said all that though, I still don't like doing the job because in a few cases I end up having to remove floorboards and cut out the offending pigtail to replace it as it's blocked solid.
I always fit a filter as part of the job and tell the customer how to service it if they don't want to be paying me each year to clean out the sludge etc. I haven't had to go back to a job other than to clean the filter for a couple of customers who can't do it themselves.

 

[Old Account]

Personally I just do a chemical clean... power flushing microbore isn't worth the hassle.

I was with a customer a few months back and they said they saw something on the web about powder flushing for microbore (just found it here POWDERFLUSH ). Anyone heard about this?

Where can you get this powder ? Can you use the powder for a normal power flush machine ? Or do you need a new machine ?

 

[Old Account]

Powder Flush was specifically designed to overcome the shortcomings power flushing has in cleaning microbore systems and I can assure you that it does NOT cause leaks and in fact causes less leaks because we don’t have to use strong acidic cleaners. The powder and pellets we use are by design, just hard enough to scrape of hardened sludge but not so hard that it can cause leaks or damage. We have various sized pellets of different densities depending on pipe size and age of the system we are cleaning. We have performed hundreds of procedures on microbore, both copper and plastic and have a much higher success rate than trying to power flush them. It is true that standard power flushing is not all that effective on microbore and it is true that Powder Flushing will get better results. We know this because around 50% of our work is on systems where power flushing has already failed to get results, at least once.

Where can I get those powder for powder flush ? Is that possible to use it with a standrard power flush machine ? Or we will need to buy a different machine ? What's the cost like ?

 

[flat Eric]

I have done a couple of power flushes on micro bore and hate the stuff, Made up a jig with valves and a pump so i can reverse to flow around the system but still going through the Magnacleanse the right way and two pumps gets it flowing.
Put a Magna clean pro 2 in 1st a week before, 2 days before drop in a bottle of MC5 cleaner ( stronger than the MC3 ). Don't rush it!!!! run through the process twice and take all day doing it ( you have priced for the day so give them what they paid for! ).
Be prepared to cut out some trouble spots and fix some leaks.
hope this helps ( and makes sense ).

 

[ShaunCorbs]

POWDER FLUSH: Better cleaning than a power flush!

 

[Robert Tyrrell]

I found out about this process last year when I was looking at power flushing machines and, as it says in their blurb, they are the ONLY people in the UK to do this so I doubt if anyone on here is going to be able to get the powder or machine unless they already work for them 🙂 They will travel anywhere in the UK but after 150 miles from London they add on fuel costs so I don't think that they're looking to franchise the process either.
The prices are extremely high if you ask me and, if you want to pay the extra, you can have a guarantee that it will solve your problem but they don't mention how much the extra is 🙂

 

[Old Account]

I found out about this process last year when I was looking at power flushing machines and, as it says in their blurb, they are the ONLY people in the UK to do this so I doubt if anyone on here is going to be able to get the powder or machine unless they already work for them 🙂 They will travel anywhere in the UK but after 150 miles from London they add on fuel costs so I don't think that they're looking to franchise the process either.
The prices are extremely high if you ask me and, if you want to pay the extra, you can have a guarantee that it will solve your problem but they don't mention how much the extra is 🙂

I have read this too but I am quite sure there is a possibility to get this powder I'll ask in Germany

 

[Robert Tyrrell]

Didn't realise that you were in Germany - I was really only thinking about the UK as this is the UK Plumbers Forum 🙂
I spent my teenage years in Germany and loved the place. 🙂

 

[Old Account]

I live in UK London but have friends and plumbers in Germany

 

[newcastle phill]

The powder cant be anything special.
Its not like this is a multi million pound company with huge R&D dept to rival sentinel or kamco etc.

I would suggest its something like crushed glass. We used to work with it years ago. Its non corrosive and i would describe it like talcum powder (but available in different grades) But very effective at cleaning in the process we used it for.
I can still get it and am gonna experiment with it the next time i cut some crapped up pipe out

 

[PowderFlush]

Size doesn’t matter when you have a registered patent for it, Phill. Our process is unique to us because we invented it, not the BIG companies with all their R&D spending.

We use a dissolvable material, so that we can retrieve 100% of the abrasive, leaving the system clean. It goes in as a solid but comes out as a liquid, that’s what makes better cleaning and retrieval possible.

It would be stupid to use a Non-dissolvable / non-retrievable material and we obviously don’t!