worcester greenstar camray utility 12/18 oil boiler water not hot enough

[Gribster]

I have a worcester greenstar camray utility 12/18 oil boiler and we have not used the hot water for years on the boiler we use it for just heating as we have electric shower and dishwasher etc. This year we thought we would use the hot water, but on turning the hot water on it only heats the water to a mild heatness and also turns the radiators on when they are turned off.

My question is... is there an easy way to fix this or is it time for a new boiler?

TIA

Dale

 

[SJB060685]

What temperature is the cylinder thermostat set to?

 

[Gribster]

What temperature is the cylinder thermostat set to?

where would that be? the pipes go upstairs and the tank is in the loft, but where should the thermostat be situated? and me not being a plumber what would it look like, and thank you very much for replying
[automerge]1597504191[/automerge]

I have a worcester greenstar camray utility 12/18 oil boiler and we have not used the hot water for years on the boiler we use it for just heating as we have electric shower and dishwasher etc. This year we thought we would use the hot water, but on turning the hot water on it only heats the water to a mild heatness and also turns the radiators on when they are turned off.

My question is... is there an easy way to fix this or is it time for a new boiler?

TIA

Dale

This is the inside of the airing cupboard and we also have an electric immersion heater, hopefully one of these will be the answer to why the water is running cold and the pipe coming into this room is hot and the rads work

 

[SimonG]

3 port valve or two 2 port valves?

 

[Gribster]

3 port valve or two 2 port valves?

I am not a plumber as you can tell, no clue sorry

 

[SJB060685]

The grey thermostat mounted on the cylinder is the cylinder thermostat. What temperature is it set to?
The valve you have is mid position valve ie, three port. Its possible that valve is stuck in the mid position, meaning the water from the boiler is circulating around both circuits and limiting the heat transfer into the cylinder.
In picture number one you can see the pump on the flow going into the three port (bottom connection). With the heating off at the programmer and hot water on at the programmer can you feel both pipes that exit the three port. If after five minutes of boiler running both pipes are hot then i suspect the valve is stuck on mid position.

 

[Gribster]

The grey thermostat mounted on the cylinder is the cylinder thermostat. What temperature is it set to?
The valve you have is mid position valve ie, three port. Its possible that valve is stuck in the mid position, meaning the water from the boiler is circulating around both circuits and limiting the heat transfer into the cylinder.
In picture number one you can see the pump on the flow going into the three port (bottom connection). With the heating off at the programmer and hot water on at the programmer can you feel both pipes that exit the three port. If after five minutes of boiler running both pipes are hot then i suspect the valve is stuck on mid position.

I think the themostat on the cylinder is for the immersion heater, but I have found ...in the the 2 new images and adjusted the switch to auto on the silver switch thingy and the red box there is a setting for 1 2 or 3 it was set to 3, but as we had lots of rubbish in the cupboard i would image it was knocked. Can you tell me what the red switch should be on. btw thank you all for all your help, really appreciate it.

 

[SJB060685]

The manual lever on the grey metal box is for filling the system, it should hold it in the mid position position and could explain why you had both CH and HW when calling for just HW. With it now in the auto position has normal operation resumed?
The 1 to 3 dial on the red pump is the pump output setting. Realistically you want that set to the lowest number that achieves the required flow and head for the system.

 

[Gribster]

The manual lever on the grey metal box is for filling the system, it should hold it in the mid position position and could explain why you had both CH and HW when calling for just HW. With it now in the auto position has normal operation resumed?
The 1 to 3 dial on the red pump is the pump output setting. Realistically you want that set to the lowest number that achieves the required flow and head for the system.

The manual lever on the grey metal box was set to auto and the red pump is now set to 2 and no change what so ever, would you suggest playing around with the drey box until it works? can this be moved when the boiler is on? thanks again. Should I try the grey box in the mid position, what postion should the grey box be in?

 

[SJB060685]

They grey box should be left in auto, which is then governed by electrical signals from the room stat and cylinder stat and programmer.
So help me help you. With the grey metal box left in auto and only the hot water on at the programmer which of the two pipes leaving the three port are hot with the burner running?
The grey thermostat mounted on the cylinder is nothing to do with the immersion heater but is the thermostat to control the boiler when heating the cylinder by the way. What temperature is that set to please? You'll see a temperature dial and a line or similar pointing to current temperature setting.

 

[Gribster]

They grey box should be left in auto, which is then governed by electrical signals from the room stat and cylinder stat and programmer.
So help me help you. With the grey metal box left in auto and only the hot water on at the programmer which of the two pipes leaving the three port are hot with the burner running?
The grey thermostat mounted on the cylinder is nothing to do with the immersion heater but is the thermostat to control the boiler when heating the cylinder by the way. What temperature is that set to please? You'll see a temperature dial and a line or similar pointing to current temperature setting.

OK the image attached is of the thermostat attached to the immersion heater, I have a tank of water in the loft a large one which is the one that needs to be heated to create the hot water. I have definately now got the switch set to auto, Pic attached detail with what pipes are hot, thanks again excuse the terrible photoshop skills 🙂

 

[SJB060685]

Please listen to me Gibster. The grey thermostat on the cylinder is the cylinder thermostat wired into the heating system controls, it has absolutely nothing to do with the immersion heater my friend. If you trace the cable from it you will see it terminates in a wiring centre where other cables go to and from, the wiring centre is the large white box you can see in other photos.
From the last image with the blue arrows it suggests to me that even though hot water is being called for the mid position valve is still in the CH position. This can be caused by a sticky valve body, the motor could have seized or burnt out (which is common on this particular design) and inside the actuator head there will be springs that help the valve to return to default position when theres no demand, the spring/springs could have failed keeping it in CH only.
The good news is whatever the problem you certainly don't need to replace the whole system. Although a modern boiler and system update would benefit you greatly the problem is by no means a system killer.

 

[SimonG]

As SJB says, relative easy fix for somebody with a set of testers and knowing what they are doing 👍

 

[Gribster]

Please listen to me Gibster. The grey thermostat on the cylinder is the cylinder thermostat wired into the heating system controls, it has absolutely nothing to do with the immersion heater my friend. If you trace the cable from it you will see it terminates in a wiring centre where other cables go to and from, the wiring centre is the large white box you can see in other photos.
From the last image with the blue arrows it suggests to me that even though hot water is being called for the mid position valve is still in the CH position. This can be caused by a sticky valve body, the motor could have seized or burnt out (which is common on this particular design) and inside the actuator head there will be springs that help the valve to return to default position when theres no demand, the spring/springs could have failed keeping it in CH only.
The good news is whatever the problem you certainly don't need to replace the whole system. Although a modern boiler and system update would benefit you greatly the problem is by no means a system killer.

sorry was ok for lunch yesterday, So basically replace the grey box, i must admit that when trying to change postion the lever has no resitance what so ever, so I do think it is probably broken. Thanks again.

 

[SJB060685]

I'm not one for changing parts willy nilly, its not a sign of a good engineer. I would get someone in just to check it over to be sure.
It was OK for lunch yesterday? What are you implying?

 

[Gribster]

sorry was ok for lunch yesterday, So basically replace the grey box, i must admit that when trying to change postion the lever has no resitance what so ever, so I do think it is probably broken. Thanks again.

out for sunday lunch.

 

[SJB060685]

out for sunday lunch.

As, I'm with you. I suggest you find someone to confirm the mentioned above and replace the unit if needed. Its not a big job, so should take much more than an hour or so.
I suggest considering a service on the boiler itself as well. Routine servicing will help prolong its life and reduce the inefficiency losses

 

[Gribster]

One last question on this thread, what part would I be looking for to replace the faulty grey box, thanks for all your help

 

[SJB060685]

I suspect you would need to replace the whole valve. Its a three port mid position valve, however I would still advise getting someone to double check everything before going ahead and buying the unit.