Ferroli modena 32c he - hot tap contamination

[Jam85]

I know these boilers don't have a good reputation but it's been reliable.

I have a hot water contamination that only ever appears on the hot tap noticing it in all the hot water outlets (collecting in mixer tap filters).

On a soft water feed.

The flakes are non conductive and didn't desolve in limescale remover.

It's flakey and brown/orange.

I can electrically isolate the boiler and run the hot tap and no contamination occurs so hot temp related maybe ?

Boiler has been in 4 years and recently serviced running like a new boiler.

Asked a few heating engineers and shown the flakes and none has identified or seen it before.

The boiler is under guarantee but I have lost the commissioning sheet and they have told me that if the fault isn't the boiler I will be charged £300.

Before I take the risk of being charged £300 wondering if anyone can help or has any idea ?

Picture attached

View attachment 20181220_094843.jpg

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Do you have a water softener?

 

[Jam85]

No softener installed but we are on a really soft supply.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

I would say there softener Cristals

There isn't a combi mate installed ?

 

[Jam85]

No combimate installed, nothing to treat the water in it goes from the supplier.

Cheers for the replies.

 

[Rob Foster]

I know these boilers don't have a good reputation but it's been reliable.

I have a hot water contamination that only ever appears on the hot tap noticing it in all the hot water outlets (collecting in mixer tap filters).

On a soft water feed.

The flakes are non conductive and didn't desolve in limescale remover.

It's flakey and brown/orange.

I can electrically isolate the boiler and run the hot tap and no contamination occurs so hot temp related maybe ?

Boiler has been in 4 years and recently serviced running like a new boiler.

Asked a few heating engineers and shown the flakes and none has identified or seen it before.

The boiler is under guarantee but I have lost the commissioning sheet and they have told me that if the fault isn't the boiler I will be charged £300.

Before I take the risk of being charged £300 wondering if anyone can help or has any idea ?

Picture attached

View attachment 36037

If you can hang on until just after Boxing Day We are going out for a meal with the designer of this unit and his bride and I will ask him if you like
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

 

[Jam85]

Wow really rob didn't expect that.

I can certainly hang on its been doing this a while now.

Thank you much appreciated.

 

[Chuck]

I'm wondering whether they are pieces of plastic rather than mineral. The picture makes the crystals look as though a thin flat sheet of the material has broken up. Is this what they look like in real life?

 

[Jam85]

Well only ever see them on the hot tap.

When I switch the boiler off they don't appear from the hot tap.

That picture is maybe a few weeks build up from the kitchen tap (trapped by the filter).

I've had theories it's a coating off maybe a pipe or like a plastic washer stuck, but then it only appears from the hot tap when boiler is switched on.

 

[Rob Foster]

Wow really rob didn't expect that.

I can certainly hang on its been doing this a while now.

Thank you much appreciated.

Sent your piccy already, he is in Italy until 28 Dec when he flies into uk for our board meeting
centralheatking

 

[Jam85]

Brilliant Rob.

Hopefully he will have some idea.

 

[Jam85]

UPDATE.

Put some of the contamination in sulphamic acid and 2-3 minutes it was fizzying and fully dissolved.

So it's limescale.

Very annoying really as I'm with Northumberland water and it says on a soft water supply.

I've done a test and it's 140ppm which is slightly hard.

Can now someone give me advice on the following.

Shall I arrange for the heat exchanger to be removed and descaled or just install one of them inline softeners £30-£70 (advice on type)

Or shall I do both?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Inline soft on the cold to the boiler

 

[Jam85]

Can you recommend any from screwfix there's plenty to choose from.

Thanks

 

[Pickwickpick]

I think in the £30 - £70 region you're just going to get a magnetic scale inhibitor rather than a water softener.

If you can, I think you'd be better off spending a bit more and fitting a combimate, they don't take up much space and are more effective than the inline magnetic ones. A real water softener would be even better but they take up more room and are iirc more expensive.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/floma...ression-connection-scale-inhibitor-15mm/1436f

I would take the 10 years with a pinch of salt tho might need replacing after 4 years

 

[Rob Foster]

Brilliant Rob.

Hopefully he will have some idea.

He called we are meeting up 4 Feb

 

[ShaunCorbs]

I think in the £30 - £70 region you're just going to get a magnetic scale inhibitor rather than a water softener.

If you can, I think you'd be better off spending a bit more and fitting a combimate, they don't take up much space and are more effective than the inline magnetic ones. A real water softener would be even better but they take up more room and are iirc more expensive.

Agree much better depends how much the op wants to spend

 

[Pickwickpick]

Agree much better depends how much the op wants to spend

Have you got any experience with Aqua Dial Combi Care Compact? It uses polyphosphates like the Combimate, but its a lot cheaper (£45 -£60). It looks a bit more utilitarian and unlike Combimate it can only be fitted onto 15mm but they claim its WRAS approved so should be suitable for protecting the HEX.

I just don't know any one in the real world that's used one, unlike the Combimate which I've heard good things about from people I trust. I do most of my work in Birmingham so its not something we have to consider with our soft Welsh water, but have been trying to decide what to fit for my mum who is down in London.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Have you got any experience with Aqua Dial Combi Care Compact? It uses polyphosphates like the Combimate, but its a lot cheaper (£45 -£60). It looks a bit more utilitarian and unlike Combimate it can only be fitted onto 15mm but they claim its WRAS approved so should be suitable for protecting the HEX.

I just don't know any one in the real world that's used one, unlike the Combimate which I've heard good things about from people I trust. I do most of my work in Birmingham so its not something we have to consider with our soft Welsh water, but have been trying to decide what to fit for my mum who is down in London.

Yes there cack they leak after a few years

 

[Pickwickpick]

Yes there cack they leak after a few years

Was worried that might be the case, Combimate it is then!

 

[Jam85]

Cheers for the help.

With it being on the low scale I'll try the screwfix link again provided. See how it goes.

Rob still might be worth him giving his opinion.

The colour still isn't really how I expect limescale to look.

Feb or Jan rob ?

 

[Pickwickpick]

The colour itself wasn't odd imo, you can get quite dark brown limescale, it was the translucence which was unusual for limescale, but I suppose depending on how and on what it forms can affect this.

 

[Jam85]

Should I descale the heat exchanger or won't it matter?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

do you have problems with hot water temp ?

if no i wouldnt

 

[Jam85]

Had not 1 issue with the boiler runs perfect.

Cheers

 

[Rob Foster]

Wow really rob didn't expect that.

I can certainly hang on its been doing this a while now.

Thank you much appreciated.

I have had our 1st board meeting of 2019. I showed your picture of the debris and its explaination to the designer of the Modena ....he catergorically rules out anything from his boiler and stated contamination in the hot water supply pipe. Hope this helps
Rob Foster aka centralheatking