Going Self-employed, advice.

[Mranon1989]

Hey everyone. Hope you all had a good Christmas/New Years.

I have to turn self-employed due to financial reasons on my bosses part.

It kind of suits me to be honest because even though I've been working for him I have missed out on a lot of days over the years due to there being little work. I stuck with him for the experience factor as it wasn't just plumbing we done. I've learned a lot to be fair which will stick with me for life.

In regards to going SE I have no idea where to start. In fairness to my boss he's told me to meet him tomorrow so he can show me what I need to do etc.

I want to make this a quick turn around and get work soon as possible.

I'm not going to establish a company, I just want to sub contract as I'm in university doing a part-time degree. Providing everything goes well with that, this time next year I'll be working as an assistant site manager working towards my degree. If it wasn't for that I wouldn't bother, I'd just work for someone else.

Any tips, advice help on generating work will be much, much appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[SimonG]

Insurance.

 

[Mranon1989]

Insurance.

Yeah definitely. I've heard some horror stories

 

[SimonG]

and don't be afraid to say no to work you are unsure of, or bringing somebody in to assist. that is, know your limitations.

 

[SimonG]

good luck, and dont be afraid to ask on here, plenty of knowledgable folk on here willing to share info.

 

[Ric2013]

Your first thought is subcontracting? I understand a plumber may want to subcontract certain aspects of a job, but you're suggesting all you want to do is subcontract work and not do any yourself or am I misreading you?
What's your course at uni?

 

[Mranon1989]

good luck, and dont be afraid to ask on here, plenty of knowledgable folk on here willing to share info.

Thanks for that, it's much appreciated. I've noticed there's a lot of knowledgable people on here.

 

[Mranon1989]

Your first thought is subcontracting? I understand a plumber may want to subcontract certain aspects of a job, but you're suggesting all you want to do is subcontract work and not do any yourself or am I misreading you?
What's your course at uni?

No I mean subcontract myself to other people. Whether it's for an agency or Joe the local builder.

It's a BSc in Project & Construction Management.

 

[rpm]

Sometimes you have to establish a company to sub contract.

 

[rpm]

Sometimes you have to establish a company to sub contract.

 

[Ric2013]

Ah, you want to take on subcontract work. Makes more sense. Though I refuse to do it myself now. More hassle with payment than with any direct customers, you can't afford to do anything you haven't quoted on as the end user isn't the one paying your bill, and I always seem to find the cheapskate contractors who don't want to pay to have the job done properly.

 

[Mranon1989]

Sometimes you have to establish a company to sub contract.

Pointless me establishing due to my plans in the future, besides I'm not GS so I'm already at a disadvantage.

 

[Mranon1989]

Ah, you want to take on subcontract work. Makes more sense. Though I refuse to do it myself now. More hassle with payment than with any direct customers, you can't afford to do anything you haven't quoted on as the end user isn't the one paying your bill, and I always seem to find the cheapskate contractors who don't want to pay to have the job done properly.

I've spoken to boys who are subbing to a builder we were doing work for and he's a terrible payer apparently. I know the builder and he's well known for it. I suppose that's just a risk I'll have to take.

 

[rpm]

Sometimes you have to establish a company to sub contract.

Pointless me establishing due to my plans in the future, besides I'm not GS so I'm already at a disadvantage.

Ok, let me say it a different way...................
SOMETIMES you HAVE TO. 🙂

 

[Mranon1989]

Ok, let me say it a different way....
SOMETIMES you HAVE TO. 🙂

Haha fair comment. Out of curiosity, what would you do in my situation?

 

[rpm]

Haha fair comment. Out of curiosity, what would you do in my situation?

Can`t really advise you, any company can be closed down easily enough after a short period of time if needs be, see what`s on offer work wise like I say you may not have a choice.

 

[SimonG]

Sole trader.

 

[Mranon1989]

Can`t really advise you, any company can be closed down easily enough after a short period of time if needs be, see what`s on offer work wise like I say you may not have a choice.

Yeah true. I'll see where I'm at in a couple of months and go from there. If I'm lucky I'll find a job in management as an undergraduate.

 

[Mranon1989]

Can`t really advise you, any company can be closed down easily enough after a short period of time if needs be, see what`s on offer work wise like I say you may not have a choice.

Yeah true. I'll see where I'm at in a couple of months and go from there. If I'm lucky I'll find a job in management as an undergraduate.

 

[Murdoch]

Sole Trader and tell HMRC

 

[Mranon1989]

Update: I spoke with my employer today and he wants me to go self employed but keep on working for him. I mean what’s the point when it’s more responsibility my end. Like I’ll have to see an accountant about tax returns and I’ll get taxed because there’s no way I’m working for 12,500 a year... No idea how to approach this.

 

[Murdoch]

Update: I spoke with my employer today and he wants me to go self employed but keep on working for him. I mean what’s the point when it’s more responsibility my end. Like I’ll have to see an accountant about tax returns and I’ll get taxed because there’s no way I’m working for 12,500 a year... No idea how to approach this.

Sounds like your "employer" is trying to avoid providing you a pension, sick pay, holiday pay ....

How much is your "employer" offering to pay you per day?

Tread carefully as HMRC are planning to tighten up on this "bogus" self employment...

Seeing an accountant is very important and will help you with understanding all the ramifications of this huge step

 

[Mranon1989]

Sounds like your "employer" is trying to avoid providing you a pension, sick pay, holiday pay ..

How much is your "employer" offering to pay you per day?

Tread carefully as HMRC are planning to tighten up on this "bogus" self employment...

Seeing an accountant is very important and will help you with understanding all the ramifications of this huge step

Probably the same as what I'm currently on which is £70 a day.

I will go to see one, the one I want to see is the same one as my employer and I'm concerned about my privacy.

I'm skint at the moment so I hope seeing one isn't too costly.

 

[island fling]

Probably the same as what I'm currently on which is £70 a day.

I will go to see one, the one I want to see is the same one as my employer and I'm concerned about my privacy.

I'm skint at the moment so I hope seeing one isn't too costly.

Can you use a different one? They don't have to be in your area as you can call/video link them & send everything by email.
You are going to have to be tough & ask for more than £70 a day as you must have your own insurance, your own vehical, tools, tax bills, accountant fees ect ect. You would be better stacking shelves than being paid £70 a day SE.
Are you qualified? Labourer? Or Apprentice?

 

[Mranon1989]

Can you use a different one? They don't have to be in your area as you can call/video link them & send everything by email.
You are going to have to be tough & ask for more than £70 a day as you must have your own insurance, your own vehical, tools, tax bills, accountant fees ect ect. You would be better stacking shelves than being paid £70 a day SE.
Are you qualified? Labourer? Or Apprentice?

I'll look into that. I'd prefer to meet with them face-to-face as I can convey more information that way.

Yeah I will and if he doesn't like it then tough. I'm worth more than that and it really isn't worth it. As you say there's all that to account for and £70 a day is a joke to be honest.

I'm fully qualified (level 3) and OFTEC but not GS even though I install gas boilers/appliances. My work is signed off from him.

 

[Murdoch]

£70 per day as a skilled SE person .......... not worth getting out of bed for and is it above the minimum wage

Remember no sick pay, no holiday pay, no bank holiday pay, no pension PLUS extra overheads

You need at least £150 per day to even consider this..

 

[Mranon1989]

£70 per day as a skilled SE person . not worth getting out of bed for and is it above the minimum wage

Remember no sick pay, no holiday pay, no bank holiday pay, no pension PLUS extra overheads

You need at least £150 per day to even consider this..

This is why I'm doing my degree because I don't see being a plumber worth the hassle.

When I'm in work for my employer I'm not only doing the job but I'm dealing with clients, arranging things as well as gathering materials for the jobs. Some times mentoring an apprentice as well.

Blessing in disguise this is. Just need to arm myself with information to state my case against him.

 

[Murdoch]

Some times mentoring an apprentice as well.

wow, hes really taking the pxss.

 

[island fling]

This is why I'm doing my degree because I don't see being a plumber worth the hassle.

When I'm in work for my employer I'm not only doing the job but I'm dealing with clients, arranging things as well as gathering materials for the jobs. Some times mentoring an apprentice as well.

Blessing in disguise this is. Just need to arm myself with information to state my case against him.

It can be worth while, if you enjoy plumbing & Heating then stick at it, it is a good rewarding job if you find the correct employer.
I had an employee that I treated like your boss is treating you......although I paid him about £90 a day. I spoke to him as his work ethic & work rate dropped once he got his SVQ & OFTEC through. Gave him a van home & 1.50 an hr extra & his attitude changed for the better. Tell you boss how you feel & he might change, without you saying how you feel maybe his is oblivious or maybe just an ar5e. Good luck with whatever you chose.

 

[Mranon1989]

It can be worth while, if you enjoy plumbing & Heating then stick at it, it is a good rewarding job if you find the correct employer.
I had an employee that I treated like your boss is treating you....although I paid him about £90 a day. I spoke to him as his work ethic & work rate dropped once he got his SVQ & OFTEC through. Gave him a van home & 1.50 an hr extra & his attitude changed for the better. Tell you boss how you feel & he might change, without you saying how you feel maybe his is oblivious or maybe just an ar5e. Good luck with whatever you chose.

I do enjoy it to be fair, however my love for the game has seriously diminished due to the low salary.

I've got my own van which I pay tax and insurance on, he does give me money for fuel in fairness and also he put me through my OFTEC. However for the amount of responsibility I have it's just not worth it.

He knows how I feel but I think he's to stuck in his own ways to up my wage to what's right so the more I think about it the more I'm seeing the positives. I'll be having a serious chat once I know everything I need to know. I'm definitely going to consult with an accountant before that.

Thanks though.

 

[Mranon1989]

wow, hes really taking the pxss.

My thoughts exactly. No wonder I hate my job.

 

[Chuck]

My thoughts exactly. No wonder I hate my job.

You need to get yourself an accountant. One that specialises in small businesses. I've always found that their advice pays for itself. They should also be able to take you through the basics of how to get your paperwork and contracts right so you don't get stiffed by reluctant payers.

Back in the day, local colleges used to run 'starting your own small business' evening classes, which were often very good. Worth investigating whether these still happen and whether there's one near you.

 

[Mranon1989]

You need to get yourself an accountant. One that specialises in small businesses. I've always found that their advice pays for itself. They should also be able to take you through the basics of how to get your paperwork and contracts right so you don't get stiffed by reluctant payers.

Back in the day, local colleges used to run 'starting your own small business' evening classes, which were often very good. Worth investigating whether these still happen and whether there's one near you.

That’s really helpful thanks for that.

I’ll definitely look into it, in the mean time I’ve been doing my own research into being SE.

Am I legally bound to register with CIS? Does my employer have to if he insists I go SE?

 

[rpm]

Double post.

 

[rpm]

It may have changed but you couldn`t be SE and only work for one company before and the employer can`t insist anything other than to terminate your employment.

 

[Mranon1989]

Yeah I read somewhere that from your self assessment they look to see if your invoices are to the same person and from that they tell you your not SE.

Yeah but I’m order for me to remain earning money I need to play ball because I can’t just jump ship to another firm due to my commitments.

 

[Pickwickpick]

It may have changed but you couldn`t be SE and only work for one company before and the employer can`t insist anything other than to terminate your employment.

To be honest in real life they don't seem to do anything about it and actually more than that, I'd say HMRC are complicit in the spread of bogus self employment as they have the powers to clamp down on it but refuse to do so.

Had a mate who worked for years on a contract for a a firm that subcontracted to one of the big delivery firms. His boss turned round to all of the drivers a couple of years back and gave them the option of either going self employed or loosing their work altogether. This fails every one of the HMRC's self employment tests and is a dodge so the boss doesn't have to pay employers NI, pension contributions... both my mate and a number of other drivers have informed the HMRC and they refuse to do anything about it.

Sorry rant over, on a more helpful note, here is a checklist that can act as I guide to determine if you would be genuinely self employed or not:

Employment status checklist - RossMartin.co.uk/