digital manometer calibration

[johnnyplumb]

My digital manometer is now 1yr old. I know they are supposed to be calibrated every year but I have checked it against my u gauge and both read the same. So what I'm saying is, if you check readings regularly against your water gauge , then why the need to calibrate.

 

[Puddle]

I do not think digital manometers have to be calibrated every year,maybe some manufacturers recommend it for extra income,as said a simple check if you wish is to test against a water filler manometer

imho

 

[tamz]

They still need calibrating. Saying you checked it against your U gauge would not hold up if anything went wrong. Modern technology is great but comes at a price.
Why do you think SGN (transco) don't give their guys digital manometers? No calibration or false reading ever on the old U gauge's.

 

[johnnyplumb]

On say a cp12, we write down burner pressure but we never write down what type of gauge we used , so if we know both gauges read the same, then who's to know what gauge was used. So when you think about it, calibration only necessary when digi gauge reads different from u gauge.

 

[Pssst]

Cant go wrong with a water guage...

 

[SimonJohns]

Testo offer calibration for their manometer. And if you use the manometer in your analyser then it's all done in one for you

 

[gasmarc]

I have a digital manometer that I bought about a month ago but still use the glass manometer

 

[AWheating]

sparks can use check boxes and result logs to prove there test equipment is in good working order but still need to have them calibrated yearly. But if the equipment is used all the time its a good way of proving your test equipment is working correctly on a daily/weekly basis, which is good if you ever need to prove good working practice to any authority.

 

[kirkgas]

i know a few manufaturers supply them to their guys for commissioning etc, but have always felt that doing a TT on my new work i just trusted the water in the guage to be right, not so sure that an electronic one which is due calibration in a couple of weeks was actually recording a good TT (just old fashioned of me, but cant seem to justify the purchase of electronic when a simple u guage does what it is supposed to)

 

[johnnyplumb]

i know a few manufaturers supply them to their guys for commissioning etc, but have always felt that doing a TT on my new work i just trusted the water in the guage to be right, not so sure that an electronic one which is due calibration in a couple of weeks was actually recording a good TT (just old fashioned of me, but cant seem to justify the purchase of electronic when a simple u guage does what it is supposed to)

once you start using electronic, its hard to go back to u gauge,theres no water spillage problems, it does'nt need to be level to get correct readings & accuracy should be ok if checked regularly against water gauge.

 

[Halesowen1]

and my one has a nice light for those dark meter cupboards, wouldn't ever go back to water manometer.

 

[kirkgas]

once you start using electronic, its hard to go back to u gauge,theres no water spillage problems, it does'nt need to be level to get correct readings & accuracy should be ok if checked regularly against water gauge.

thats my point "SHOULD" isnt good enough for my new installs, i appreciate it will prob be ok and it will be down to me being old fashioned,, but the water in my guage tells me whether i have a leak or not, it is also down to my victor meldrew "what if" mode but if you feel the need to check it periodically against a u guage, why buy and calibrate it, seems like too much bother to me, and TBH, self calibrating against your u guage would never stand up in court if your electronic was found wanting in between official calibrations, and i bet when you send it in for a £50 calibration it is done by checking it against their old u guage haha, but they are certified to do it and give you a nice shiney sticker

 

[CMairiD]

I am officially gadget girl ... love 'em; however, have tried and can't deal with electronic manos. Gimme my Regin Premier any day.

 

[Halesowen1]

No need to try and stand it up, or hang it from something. Torch stuck in your mouth trying to set the thing to zero. I cannot believe there are people out there who are still using water gauge, the only ones I tend to see are the ones still using 110v tranny and leads everywhere for drilling and cutting. Go and spend a little you cant take it with you.

 

[AWheating]

once you start using electronic, its hard to go back to u gauge,theres no water spillage problems, it does'nt need to be level to get correct readings & accuracy should be ok if checked regularly against water gauge.

i used an electronic on for a couple of years, then it broke and i went back to water. Never ever thought about going back to electronic.... i have a mini testo one for gas valve pressures but i only use it a couple of times a year. Each to there own.

 

[johnnyplumb]

i did think about a regin premier , are they totally spill proof, if its not spill proof then could end up costly as fluid is not cheap.

 

[CMairiD]

In 1.5 years, I've not needed to top up. Equally, only minor and very FEW adjustments to zero.

 

[johnnyplumb]

thats my point "SHOULD" isnt good enough for my new installs, i appreciate it will prob be ok and it will be down to me being old fashioned,, but the water in my guage tells me whether i have a leak or not, it is also down to my victor meldrew "what if" mode but if you feel the need to check it periodically against a u guage, why buy and calibrate it, seems like too much bother to me, and TBH, self calibrating against your u guage would never STAND UP IN COURT if your electronic was found wanting in between official calibrations, and i bet when you send it in for a £50 calibration it is done by checking it against their old u guage haha, but they are certified to do it and give you a nice shiney sticker

STAND UP IN COURT I USED MY U GAUGE YOUR HONOUR honest

 

[johnnyplumb]

when i had the gas safe inspection, the inspector used a manometer with an analogue dial. it wasnt a water gauge or electronic type just a pressure gauge with pointer. anyone seen this type before.

 

[gasmarc]

no I have not seen that but I am tempted to start using my digital one now as it is a pain using and carry around the glass manometer, all that balancing agg etc

 

[darking]

probably a tyre pressure gauge who knows

 

[Pssst]

Fact is that with water guages you cant go wrong. Water has a definite SG,its free and when used in a U guage or a J guage in the correct manner,is a more direct means of measuring pressure. It is easy to believe that anything digital is by default better or more accurate but thats like saying that speed on a satnav in a car is more accurate than the speedometer. The more closely the quantity to be measured is geared to the measuring device,the more accurate it is. Digital manometer..? Well the pressure is applied to some kind of transducer. This produces an output which is interpreted by some electronics and is then displayed on a screen. Gauge..pressure is directly applied to the surface of a column of water..erm..and thats it.

In my kit i have 1 30Mb water manometer, A 60mb water guage and a 120mb high Sg J guage..i wouldnt use anything else...i would however use a combustion analyser instead of draegar tubes simply because there is a case and need for greater accuracy..!

 

[darking]

Now that is what I call a reasoned approach a mix of simple physics combined with sophisticated technology for specific needs

 

[Halesowen1]

But many plumbers I have seen cannot see the line on a water gauge, and I doubt many of you older or poor sighted plumbers could see a .5mb drop for let by on a water gauge. It is a dam sight easier with a digital and thats all i am bothered about, why make a job hard??
Dont trust a manometer but do trust flue analyser?? dont make sense to me.

 

[darking]

I doubt many of you older or poor sighted plumbers could see a .5mb drop for let by on a water gauge.

Present company excepted, one hopes? or do you discriminate against older and hopefully wiser blokes that have, where necessary, been to specsavers

 

[Halesowen1]

You must have seen the old fellow, fumbling after his glasses and sits their looking at a water manometer, when he cannot see his hand let alone a water level moving.

 

[CMairiD]

That's why I have the Regin Premier; the gauge is very easy to read, even in darkened areas.

 

[Halesowen1]

Easier than a digital with a light, I just prefer to make my working day as easy as possible.
Cordless tools, core drills etc. It costs more but makes life a hell of a lot easier.
I dont disagree that water are good but IMO not anywhere near a digital, magnetic case, light for dark cupboards, no need to try and stand up level etc.

 

[gasmarc]

I presume that is the green metal cover with the glass tube , I have one of those also which is superb and easy to read, Someone mention about putting water in the gauge it is easier to use the correct fluid as it is coloured and easy to see. I have yet to use my digital one yet but will try it out shortly, I think its what ever your happy using , regarding yearly calibration I think that is a load of rubbish but would not surprise me if they try and enforce it.

 

[Halesowen1]

My old Tpi digital manometer is 8 years old, same model as my new one. I checked the old one today as it has not been used for a few years and never ever been calibrated, and it is smack on still, exactly same reading as brand new one.
Might get it calibrated and sell it on here. Or offer it to one of you water gauge guys to try and see how you feel with one.

 

[gasmarc]

my ones a tpi one also so that is a result , do you have a mini valve on your hose to get exact 10 millibar for let by test or not

 

[Halesowen1]

No mini valve, tpi 621 i believe my 2 are. Very good gear that tpi, I have recently changed my Flue analyser to the tpi712, same as BG use. Best one I have used, and very good calibration etc through JWM or JMW, never remember whcih one.

 

[gasmarc]

i got a good a TPI multimeter which is the muts nuts , is it not awkward getting exact pressure , I have a valve on my hose but it is for use with my v2 sprint , thats another thing I have not used yet

 

[Pssst]

I'm not sure its a matter of trust. Its just using the right tool for the right job IMHO.

My gauges..well they are simple devices but i treat them as precision instruments. I periodically strip them, clean them,flush them through with bleach and water and reassemble them. In this way they remain highly readable. I ensure they are vertical when read and i use a bright LED portable torch to read them where necessary.

As for combustion analysers..well my comparison was made with draegar pumps and tubes. If you have ever used them,you will know that there is greater scope for error both in use and interpretation of results and because of this,they have largely been superseded.

Now then..if we go back to your simple low pressure water gauge,,,if it is well maintained...a simple job to do...then when its reading 20mb..the chances are that it is indeed reading 20mb or as close as makes no difference.

However, if you attach a digital guage..to the same pressure source and it read 23mb...how would you know if it was wrong or right?..you see, as long as there are no obstructions in the flow path of the u gauge and it only contains water..it IS going to read 20mb gauge pressure.




There is also the whole issue of reading differential pressures and more than one pressure..do you buy 2,3 or more electronic gauges..? It can get pricey.

If i had any doubt about let by..i;d disconnect and use LDF and/or a gas detection instrument.

Still ,each to their own

i must be old school...

 

[gasmarc]

As i said I have both , regarding cleaning I have never done that in my life and mine is perfect to read as it is glass with the correct fluid in it. Time will tell I suppose I use to have a monument the yellow plastic one which is rubbish , you cannot beat the glass regin ones . I disagree with what you say about reading the correct pressures etc ,If they did not work they would not use them, A manometer is a smaller version of a spirit level , clear plastic hose with few marking on each end and away you go