Fit a Magnaclean on an old boiler/central heating system

[camerart]

Hi,

I'm sure a Magnaclean is a good device for keeping the central heating system clean. What I want to know is if the system is old and has inhibitor in, why is it needed? I've just cleaned the system and got lots of sludge etc out. This must mean that the system wears thin, so if the Magnaclean takes out material is it just a matter of time before the system needs replacing anyway?

Cheers, Camerart.

I've cleared up some marketing posts in this thread.
Dan

 

[SimonJohns]

Nothing lasts forever.

A magnaclean will just keep the system working efficiently and help valves and other components from getting damaged .

 

[CES]

As above, it can prevent sludge accumulating and causing blockages within small bore pipework, heat exchangers etc.
Inhibitor levels need to be controlled and topped up every so often also.

 

[GrahamM]

Hi,

I'm sure a Magnaclean is a good device for keeping the central heating system clean. What I want to know is if the system is old and has inhibitor in, why is it needed? I've just cleaned the system and got lots of sludge etc out. This must mean that the system wears thin, so if the Magnaclean takes out material is it just a matter of time before the system needs replacing anyway?

Cheers, Camerart.

The combination of metals, water and air in the system react together chemically and produce sludge. This is what builds up in system and clogs it up.
The magna catches some of this sludge helping the system to stay that bit cleaner.

 

[stevetheplumber]

lets be honest here 7 years ago hardly any system had a magnaclean and they worked fine. The point of a magna clean is to protect the new condensing boilers which are realy not suitable for use on a pre used system
we used to remove a cast iron boiler, fit a new combi ,on a system that had been in use with an open vent for 20 plus years and it would work without any problems.Try doing that with one of the substandard steamers weve had foisted upon us as part of the great global warming scam ,as it will be called in the future when the new ice age will be upon us
Why do heat exchangers have such small water ways ?increase the size by a mm and no problem its all about profit

 

[SimonJohns]

Smaller the water way. Larger the surface area for thermal transfer. It's just physics.

 

[aggis]

A filter/magnetic on a system has got to be a good thing,but it has to be backed up by a clean/cleaned system with inhibitors.
The inhibitor needs regularly checking or topping up, [every couple of years or when any alterations to the system].
Again the important thing even when just a radiator maybe replaced, the system needs cleaning, especially on systems with new boilers as they are very prone to corrosion. The heat exchangers maybe made of allumium & it is critical to keep a neutral ph & even the production greases & swarf from a new radiator can contaminate the system & start the production of sludge/magnetite.
The old boilers made of cast iron had larger waterways & were very thick, so the dirt/sludge in the didn't effect the heat exchanger, but often caused blocked circ's/cold feeds,cold spots & pin holes in radiators after quite a number of years.
The issue of fitting a filter/magnetic filter is an important part of protecting the system & boiler, especially with boilers that have plate heat exchangers, not just condensating boilers, otherwise the plate heat exchanger becomes the filter,resulting in costly repairs to the boiler [new plate h exch] & the system then needing chemically if not powerflushing.
We as proffessional plumbers/engineers need to educate the customers that having, say someone fit a radiator/boiler at the cheapest price [ie just banging it on the wall & filling it up.] is not the best & cheapest option in the long run.
You wouldn't want a mechanic to service your car & put the old oil back into the engineeer!!!
Fit it, clean it & protect it. You will be respected & paid for the extra work as long as you explain why you're doing this.

 

[camerart]

lets be honest here 7 years ago hardly any system had a magnaclean and they worked fine. The point of a magna clean is to protect the new condensing boilers which are realy not suitable for use on a pre used system
we used to remove a cast iron boiler, fit a new combi ,on a system that had been in use with an open vent for 20 plus years and it would work without any problems.Try doing that with one of the substandard steamers weve had foisted upon us as part of the great global warming scam ,as it will be called in the future when the new ice age will be upon us
Why do heat exchangers have such small water ways ?increase the size by a mm and no problem its all about profit

1st, thank you all for answering.

Steve,

I am an amateur so didn't go to plumber school. But you seem to be thinking in a similar way, that made me ask this question.

My boiler is an old cast iron one, and works just fine. I follow the argument that water and air and metal mix to cause sludge, but I am assuming the chemical inhibitor, is supposed to stop this. So providing I don't dilute it, and maybe add another bottle it up every few years, I'm guessing I am not going to benefit from a Magnaclean that much. As I already said, I'm sure it's a good thing to have though.

So, are there any guesses how long between system flush/clean/add chemical, compared with the same but fitted with a Magnaclean? And will one prolong the life of the system?

Cheers, Camerart.

 

[stevetheplumber]

personally i dont think adding a magnaclean will make any difference to your existing system just keep the inhibitor topped up and avoid draining the system any more than you have to

 

[stevetheplumber]

Smaller the water way. Larger the surface area for thermal transfer. It's just physics.

not sure how that works if the waterway is circular with a diameter of 2mm the surace area will be 2x3.142=6.284 x length of water way if the waterway is smaller at 1mm then the surface will be halved at 3.142xlength of water way

 

[CES]

It will enable any sludge that does occur to be collected instead of circulating and possibly settling in radiators. Personally I cant see how it couldn't make a difference.

 

[tamz]

the great global warming scam ,as it will be called in the future when the new ice age will be upon us

I like that bit Steve. The general consensus is we all zip up the back :lol:

 

[camerart]

personally i dont think adding a magnaclean will make any difference to your existing system just keep the inhibitor topped up and avoid draining the system any more than you have to

Ok, Thanks.

 

[julesverne]

You wouldn't want a mechanic to service your car & put the old oil back into the engine!!!
Fit it, clean it & protect it. You will be respected & paid for the extra work as long as you explain why you're doing this.

that a great analogy

 

[FD Powerflow]

whilst an inhibitor does only slow the corrosion process down, not stop it the rate of corrosion is measured in millimetres per year and a good inhibitor should limit even mild steel to less than 0.1mm per year. If you get your tape measure out and look at the size of 1mm then imagine a tenth of that I can't see how that could cause of damage.

I can't imagine anyone fitting a filter to a brand new system so I think it might need a bit of a change of market strategy if that is your plan. There's nothing wrong with the current attitude of cleansing an old system and fitting a TF1 or Magnaclean to it to prevent dirty systems from messing up new boilers.

 

[Rickster123]

Steve don't be so quick to judge.... Let's see what freebies adey are dishing out first!

 

[galaxy_plumbing]

Hi Adey, bit off topic. Is there a way to apply for test mug to show customers how does magnaclean work? Thank you

 

[bspareltd]

Obviously , adey never have anybody watching there tests . The BS number on there box is a test for central heating boilers , nothing to do with the filter . There is no BS standard for magnetic filters.

 

[Destroyer2813]

Adey are the pioneers in the magnetic industry but still cant fit a drain off to there filter to allow you drain out the water

 

[bspareltd]

i am going to launch a filter with a drain off. Also with a simple device that does capture non magnetic particles. Got PATENT pending on my filter .It will be cheaper than magnaclean and the tf1 .

 

[stevetheplumber]

i am going to launch a filter with a drain off. Also with a simple device that does capture non magnetic particles. Got PATENT pending on my filter .It will be cheaper than magnaclean and the tf1 .

details ? evaluation samples ? independent testing ?

 

[Centralheatking]

If you have an old boiler then the water pathways thro it are huge and you can drive
a bus thro. New fancy condensing ones do not - in fact the heat exchangers are so
small and the water way so narrow like micsron size u need to stop the sludge and bits
from blockin the new boilers up - old ones dont need constant protection just
heat it up max once a year drop all the hot water out and bung in some cheap sludge
preventer job done.

centralheatking

 

[petercj]

If you have an old boiler then the water pathways thro it are huge and you can drive
a bus thro. New fancy condensing ones do not - in fact the heat exchangers are so
small and the water way so narrow like micsron size u need to stop the sludge and bits
from blockin the new boilers up - old ones dont need constant protection just
heat it up max once a year drop all the hot water out and bung in some cheap sludge
preventer job done.

centralheatking

Why on earth haven't Vaillant built a filter into their boilers as a standard component?

The big Nationals, BG, Johny Ball's lot, and others advertising on TV, now seem to be using WB boilers, and I wonder whether that is because Vaillant's tiny wire heat exchangers that regularly get blocked has swayed these companies towards WB.

Seems like a bad move by Vaillant to me to leave their top of the range boilers unprotected for the sake of an extra few quid to build a filter in. Maybe this oversight has come back to bite them where it hurts! :sweatdrop:

 

[tamz]

The no spanners any more with the TF1's is doing my nut in. Spent 5 minutes today wrestling with one to get it opened.

 

[Mike Jackson]

Why on earth haven't Vaillant built a filter into their boilers as a standard component?

The big Nationals, BG, Johny Ball's lot, and others advertising on TV, now seem to be using WB boilers, and I wonder whether that is because Vaillant's tiny wire heat exchangers that regularly get blocked has swayed these companies towards WB.

Seems like a bad move by Vaillant to me to leave their top of the range boilers unprotected for the sake of an extra few quid to build a filter in. Maybe this oversight has come back to bite them where it hurts! :sweatdrop:

The reason the big guys are using WB is because they give large rebates to big customers. I can't see any of the boiler manufacturers fitting magnetic filters to their boilers. How would they wriggle out of warranty claims then?