New gas meter and my Ideal boiler breaks down - any ideas why?

[ariel1973]

I had my gas meter changed by the Onstream contractor for the gas company, at their request. Afterwards, the contractor tested my Ideal boiler which gave the error message that the ignition had locked out, to check other gas appliances (they were fine) and to call the installer. The contractor repeated the reset process 5 times and left saying that there was a problem with my boiler - I was left in the cold with my daughter who had special medical needs, in minus temperatures. Since I have Homeserve cover, I contacted them and eventually attended the following evening. The boiler repair man told me that the change of gas meter may have sent some muck into the system and he thinks the fan is damaged now (everything worked absolutely fine before the visit and the boiler is just 2 years old). Can anyone explain to me how 'muck' could have gotten into the system, when gas pipes are sealed? I would also like to know if any more damage could have been caused to my boiler? The gas company is implying the boiler was faulty and as I say it isn't very old and I have had it serviced annually. Many Thanks.

 

[mikegas]

did he purge the system? simple things first

 

[ariel1973]

No, as far as I know - unless you do that at the site of the gas meter. He certainly did nothing inside with the boiler before he replaced the meter.

 

[diamondgas]

Keep trying reset! It may just be air from replacing the meter!!! You will not do yourself any harm by continuing to attempt to re-set the boiler .. IMO

Regards the meter installer PHAAAAA! They are not qualified to give an opinion! Honestly they are not trained to work on appliances! As far as I am aware anyways!

 

[mikegas]

do you have any other gas appliances?

 

[tamz]

The guy swapping the meter should have purged the gas through to the boiler and all other appliances when he was done. Cookers and fires are easy for him to do but boilers usually require using tools.
Meter fitters are not the sharpest tools in the box but saying that there are a few beauties work with homeserve too.
What model of boiler is it and as Diamondgas said it won't do any harm to try resetting it a few more times.

 

[Mike Jackson]

There could be debris (rust from iron pipes, installation debris) in the gas pipes that was disturbed when the meter was changed but I fail to see how that could get into the fan as there is a filter on the inlet to the gas valve.

 

[ariel1973]

Thanks.
I don't believe he did anything to the boiler 1st and certainly didn't get tools out - I got the manuals out for him to show how to reset the system. It is an ideal logic + combi 30.

 

[ariel1973]

my other appliance (gas cooker) was fine straight away.

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

keep trying to reset it as said there are some right numptys with both homeserve and meter installers ,and some ideals are a right pain to reset

 

[quality]

Thats ok call the Ideal helpline and you should get an engineer out tomorrow
before you do that make sure the pressure gauge is above 1 Bar if not then top up the pressure

 

[mikegas]

my other appliance (gas cooker) was fine straight away.

ok, if you only had a boiler on the system i would of been more certain it was air but still could be, as said try a few more resets

 

[Mike Jackson]

Whay have you got homeserve? The logic + has got a 5 year warranty.

 

[ariel1973]

yes it was the homeserve chap who said there is muck in it and needs a new fan

 

[mountainman]

I don't know if meter fitters test the working pressure after installation, but if the meter is faulty or is restricted (possible) and restricting the flow of gas then a high burning appliance like a boiler may not be receiving the correct pressure and locking out, wouldn't be an issue on a cooker or fire.

 

[quality]

yes it was the homeserve chap who said there is muck in it and needs a new fan

Thats like saying you need a new tyre because you parked on the road

 

[Rickster123]

Ariel where abouts are you based?

 

[quality]

Ariel where abouts are you based?

Best post yet

 

[jtsplumbing]

Have you checked to make sure that the gas valve under the boiler is turned on ?? Is boiler showing a fault code ?

 

[Mbear]

There will be no ''muck" in the fan, the gas must pass through the gas valve b4 It even gets to the fan, the gas valve has a gauze filter and therefore would filter out any debri. Although, if there is alot of debri at the filter it could restrict the gas working pressure and this would/could cause a lockout.

 

[jhon lennon]

sounds to me like the homeserve guy was in a rush to get somewhere else the fan is not in any way connected to the gas supply so i dont even know why he came up with that the supply has air in it simple as that the meter installer has the responsibility to recommission all appliances be four he leaves because he must check the regulator working pressure this is a mandatory check under gas safe regulations and if i were you i would have a go at relighting it if no luck contact the contractor first thing to come back and the n cancel your homeserve contract hope your daughter is ok any decent gas bloke if he couldn't get your boiler going would have at the very least got you sorted with some emergency heating until any parts needed were sourced given your circumstances good luck let us know how you get on

 

[mountainman]

Getting into the realms of a GS engineers expertise again methinks.
If it is debris disturbed by the installation of a new meter the supplier would not accept responsibility but without pressure readings everything is speculation.

 

[Mbear]

sounds to me like the homeserve guy was in a rush to get somewhere else the fan is not in any way connected to the gas supply so i dont even know why he came up with that the supply has air in it simple as that the meter installer has the responsibility to recommission all appliances be four he leaves because he must check the regulator working pressure this is a mandatory check under gas safe regulations and if i were you i would have a go at relighting it if no luck contact the contractor first thing to come back and the n cancel your homeserve contract hope your daughter is ok any decent gas bloke if he couldn't get your boiler going would have at the very least got you sorted with some emergency heating until any parts needed were sourced given your circumstances good luck let us know how you get on

Are U sure the fan isn't connected to the gas supply in any way? I must imagine gas entering and mixing with air in a condensing fan b4 if gets to the burner.

 

[jhon lennon]

the fan is not part of the gas supply it is part of the pre mix to the burner the only change this lady has had is the meter has been swapped so the chances of a piece of debris getting past the filter on the inlet and than past the zero govner then through the gas valve and being big enough to damage the fan is at best a little unlikely so its allays sensible to start at basics and purge the thing it may take a few tries but eventually enough air should be removed to enable the gas to be re instated when removing the meter for any reason the appliances must be recommissioned and this means purging must take place

 

[Mbear]

The fan is in the gas line though, albeit toward the end of it.

 

[jhon lennon]

in this case it is my friend but would you not agree if you changed the wheel on your car and it now had a wobble on it is the wheel going to be the problem or has your drive shaft suddenly gone same thing it worked be four now it does not so its the gas supply that's the problem this may be down to a blockage but a quick check at the inlet pressure test point would confirm this 20 mbar is preferable but with this u would probably get ignition even down to 14 mbar even if it just roles out then dies

 

[peteheat]

I suggest you go back to the source of the problem, your boiler was working before the meter exchange so call your gas supply customer support line and advise them you have a problem and intend calling in a private contractor at their expence however you are prepared to give them one last chance to send a competant person to fix the boiler within a reasonable time.

 

[REDSAW]

like tomorrow!.

 

[quality]

Thats where you local friendly neighborhood plumber knocks spots off these large outfits.
If it were my customer I would be there ASAP but because these folk pay homeserve or whoever they have to put up with this rubbish.

Get a reliable Plumber.com sounds good to me

 

[bubblegas]

I used to work for OnStream and most of them only have CCN1 & MET1 so are not allowed to work on appliances. I have all tickets but was told I was not to work on appliances either.

I had many occasions where pilots wouldn't relight (faulty piezo or thermocouple) and was told by OnStream not to work on the appliance in any way. The fault was classed as existing, which technically it was, but try explaining that to a vunerable customer on a cold day. I had to say not my fault, call a gsr plumber.
Back to the topic, if the meterworker turned down the heating on a combi to change the meter rather than turning it off, customer uses hot tap, gas pipe empty and can take many resets to get the gas through, especially on a long run. He would definately have purged but I bet he used the hob, nice and easy. He should have done visual check of appliances (flue, flame pic, Ventilation) and taken a working pressure. If the boiler is the most downstream point he should have cracked a union open and purged there.

 

[stevetheplumber]

surely the fan isnt in the gas line the fan only supplies air to the venturi/ mix tube where the gas is entrained into the burner

 

[mountainman]

After all this time and so many resets there is no way that it is a purging problem.
The only way forward IMHO is to get the meter fitters back with a technical bod.
Previous experience has proved to me that a major lottery win is more likely.
Possibly a call to Gas Safe or Trading standards may help. But realistically getting a heating engineer in to get the boiler working and providing a report would seem the best option right now.

 

[tamz]

Gas Safe and trading standards will not be interested.
Meter fitters have a responsibility to do the job correctly but they are not responsible for appliances that will not relight. If they start taking it apart to fix or investigate they are then assuming responsibility for whatever may be causing it. That won't happen so after a reasonable time trying they will switch it off and tell the customer /householder to get someone in and if they don't know anyone they advise contacting gas safe for names of local firms. All std documented procedure.
These things happen and are usually unrelated to any work carried out.
If it is found to be due to something caused by the work they done, they will reimburse the costs and inconvenience.

 

[ariel1973]

The Ideal boiler guy has got the boiler going although has disconnected the fan. When they replace the fan, hopefully next week, I will get a report of the problem and send it to the two organisations - that is a great idea! Thanks

 

[jtsplumbing]

How has he got the boiler going without the fan ?? Boiler will-not work if fan not working !! :disguise:

 

[ariel1973]

Thanks JTS, maybe I assumed he had disconnected it, as he said that it was the problem and needed replacing. He said he thought it was the problem because it was so noisy - although in my opinion it doesn't sound any different to normal - it has always been very noisy, in my limited experience of living in about 4 different houses over the years...