Ideal Icos HE 24

[merv]

Hi, I've went to have a look at a boiler fault several days ago. (FL) flashing.

I understand this to be a flame rectification fault.

I rang Ideal and was told to check the black rectification wire for continuity and got a good reading 1.6 ohms. I removed probe and cleaned. Removed fan and burner, cleaned heat exchanger. Boiler worked fine for a couple of days but now gone to FL again.

Is it time for a new PCB.

Any feedback will be greatly appreciated!

 

[Ermintrude]

Or flame rectification electrode lead.

 

[Aquazone]

For the price of a lead and rec probe, I would change them, if still plays up then PCB.
Explain to customer that your trying to save them money and they won't mind one bit!!!! If lead and probe work, you will be in their good books forever.

 

[merv]

Yes, to be honest, I was thinking the same thing. Changing the cheaper parts first. I hate the thought of changing PCB to find it's made no difference!!

 

[lame plumber]

I cna never remember if these have the earth prongs as well which can be a pain.

 

[Ermintrude]

No think it's revised design with earth back to. Orange box of hell now?

 

[merv]

This one has two wires from the black PCB box ..... Black & earth.... Earth going to fan. Black to rectification

 

[Ollieg]

condence trap blockage can cause FL too.

 

[Ermintrude]

Assumes that was checked when he washed it oot?

 

[merv]

Thank you, I will check that out tomorrow,

 

[merv]

When I first arrived I removed the bottom plate on the heat exchanger. It was bone dry. Even pulled out an old biro pen which seamed a bit weird

 

[IDCHAPPY]

When I first arrived I removed the bottom plate on the heat exchanger. It was bone dry. Even pulled out an old biro pen which seamed a bit weird

:lol:

 

[Whyme]

I know its a cop out but icos/isars always get the "Better ring ring ideal for a service call" advice. Price of a pcb + labour from us would be more pricey especially with a nice seasoning of doubt.

 

[Millsy 82]

Is it trying to fire or is it coming up at random intervals? I wouldnt go replacing the board just yet they are expensive and chances are it will be something else that you havnt checked yet.

1 Rectification lead can melt and it arcs out to the heat exchanger (this will generally be the cause if it goes to lockout straight away without firing)

2 Check the condense trap for blockages

3 Check the ignition probe as these warp out of shape quite alot this can also cause explosive ignition

4 Actually check the spark (I shut the gas off whip the top off heat ex connect electric to fan and go to fire it up be careful not to get a shock!)

5 If probes look ok check you get power to ignition generator if you do replace that.

6 If you dont get power to ignition generator then start looking at pcb.

 

[merv]

Hi Millsy, the problem with the boiler is the pump runs, fan runs. You can here it all rev up ignition, fire and then drops off after about 2 seconds.. Had lid off, cleaned rectification probes and spark. Cleaned heat exchanger, checked condense trap. All clear...... Checked harness. 1.6 ohms..

 

[Paulplumb]

Remember not as experienced as you lot so don't shoot me down. Silly question. You are putting the combustion door back on with the four screws before you try to run the boiler aren't you?

 

[merv]

No, not a silly question but yes, tried with door off and with door on

 

[Whyme]

Have you tried adjusting the offset on the gas valve, gas valve could be playing up..

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

Remember not as experienced as you lot so don't shoot me down. Silly question. You are putting the combustion door back on with the four screws before you try to run the boiler aren't you?

wont make a difference with this heap,Merv,worth checking the det probe lead to pcb routing they can chaff on the combustion box entry point and also get trapped on the drop down pcb retaining bracket if the pcb,s been changed before(highly likely it has)

 

[Millsy 82]

Hi Millsy, the problem with the boiler is the pump runs, fan runs. You can here it all rev up ignition, fire and then drops off after about 2 seconds.. Had lid off, cleaned rectification probes and spark. Cleaned heat exchanger, checked condense trap. All clear...... Checked harness. 1.6 ohms..

If it is actually firing up then I would be looking rectification probe or probably what I should of put as no 1 gas inlet pressure.

 

[Millsy 82]

Remember not as experienced as you lot so don't shoot me down. Silly question. You are putting the combustion door back on with the four screws before you try to run the boiler aren't you?

Only if gas safe or some other inspector is there. If they are not then I don't worry about it too much.

Some boilers won't fire with the case removed (positive pressure cases mainly but also a few negative pressure cases) it's a pain having to put a case back on just to take it back off again.

 

[Whyme]

If it drops off after 2 seconds adjust the offset cos maybe straying.

 

[Paulplumb]

Thanks Milsy . Is there an orange sticker on the combustion chamber door indicating the burner earthing pins have been changed to the new coat hanger type? Maybe check you have a good earth?

 

[Paulplumb]

Just dug out the engineers/training day manual for this boiler and they made us add this note as this can also cause the fl lf fault.

The boiler only has a 52 mm seal in the condensate trap so if the overflow from the boiler is run directly into a waste system it should have an air break before running into a trap with a 76 mm seal to prevent air locking. might be worth running condensate directly into bucket to test? Good luck!

 

[Millsy 82]

Thanks Milsy í*½í¸€. Is there an orange sticker on the combustion chamber door indicating the burner earthing pins have been changed to the new coat hanger type? Maybe check you have a good earth?

I never trust the orange sticker the top comes off every time for me. Even the coat hanger type warp out of shape so better to check them. Once you work on a few it doesn't take too long.

 

[arran197]

I would be checking the condense trap too. Although there are quite a few things that could cause this fault. Check the gas pressure on the inlet to make sure that's ok. The black flame rectification lead often melts and shorts out (as has been said), due to poor design. They're not very expensive, so worth doing.

Change the earth/insulation pad retention pins, as has been said, they've been redesigned (again, poor design) and need changing anyway. I've had to AR a few for having warped pins that cause the pads to collapse and the the boiler melts itself!

The ignition and flame rectification electrodes also warp and don't allow ignition or rectification. Best thing is to replace them, they're not too expensive either. You need to make sure you get the right ones for the right boiler as there's a couple. You'll need the serial number.

Check polarity is correct and there's a good earth connection where they should be.

 

[rich201283]

1.) if the boiler is firing and then cutting out after 2 secs, I would check flame detection electrode and lead, the leads are located near the heat ex and go brittle, bits fall off and then the lead earth against the heat ex.
2.) check the flame detection electrode

3.) if the boiler runs for a while and then cuts out going to fl, check condensate sump and traps clear

After checking these, move on to be pcb checking

From what you describe it will be the flame detection electrode or lead