New and wanting help. Air in the system?

[Francisco Barros]

Hi
Got a new house and has a power shower fitted.

A few weeks after moving in the shower started to struggle, like water wasn’t coming through.
Got a “Triton power shower” but the problem still there. Sometimes worked a little better and sometimes didn’t but always struggling , sounded like an engine when stationary but still pressing on the pedal.

Got a plumber and he fitted a valve in the loft to release the air.

Problem still there and he advise to replace the shower was it was faulty.

Got a new shower today and before I installed it done some tests:
- try to bleed the radiator in the bathroom that it’s connected to the hot water system (at least it’s what I think), no luck.
- check the water coming to the shower pipes without anything attached and clearly can be seen struggling.
- used the trick to block the hot water in the kitchen and while blocked open the cold, no luck.

Fitted the new shower but still doesn’t work.
Tried to let it run without the shower head and it does run (struggles) but 10 minutes later wife goes to have shower and doesn’t work, goes dry.

I have water tank in the loft that feed the hot water tank, the locking thing works.
In the kitchen there is a boiler that heats the water and does the radiators.

It doesn’t have a Surrey or Sussex flange but after discussing it with the plumber he says the way it is should work.

Any help would be welcome as I am relying on a jug for shower as the other shower in the bath has no pressure.

 

[rpm]

Hi
Got a new house and has a power shower fitted.

A few weeks after moving in the shower started to struggle, like water wasn’t coming through.

Anything else done in the house in these few weeks?

 

[townfanjon]

Can we double check , the shower is defo a power shower . ie it has an internal pump ? And uses tank fed cold and hot water from the cylinder.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Anything else done in the house in these few weeks?

I installed a nest and have the tank on a schedule to come on twice a day. Also the electric back up heating element it’s always off.
Don’t believe they are related.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Can we double check , the shower is defo a power shower . ie it has an internal pump ? And uses tank fed cold and hot water from the cylinder.

Yes correct, no heating element just the pump. Cold from the tank in the loft and and hot from the cylinder T on the top/ left .

 

[Francisco Barros]

When I turn the cold water feed from the tank in the loft to the the cylinder off, there is no water coming out of the taps. Is this a normal behaviour?

 

[townfanjon]

Ideally your taps should be “mains “ fed but some are tank fed, does this turn the cold to the shower off ?

 

[Francisco Barros]

Ideally your taps should be “mains “ fed but some are tank fed, does this turn the cold to the shower off ?

Don’t know what you mean by that? They are mains as they got pressure. My finger doesn’t stop the flow , where as in the hot does .

 

[townfanjon]

Not sure myself pal , a power shower should not be mains fed , it should be fed by a tank ( cold from tank in loft , hot by the cylinder )

 

[Francisco Barros]

Not sure myself pal , a power shower should not be mains fed , it should be fed by a tank ( cold from tank in loft , hot by the cylinder )

It is being fed by the tank and not mains. And hot water from cylinder.

 

[Ric2013]

Can you confirm that the cold to the shower is a separate pipe all the way to the cylinder?
Also, you say there is no flange to the cylinder. You do, however, have a separate pipe all the way from the shower to the cylinder for the hot? And how does this connect to the cylinder? Can you photo or sketch it for us?

 

[Francisco Barros]

Can you confirm that the cold to the shower is a separate pipe all the way to the cylinder?
Also, you say there is no flange to the cylinder. You do, however, have a separate pipe all the way from the shower to the cylinder for the hot? And how does this connect to the cylinder? Can you photo or sketch it for us?

Hot comes from the cylinder as seen on the photo. When in the loft, there is a cold feet that comes from the tank and runs parallel with the hot into the power shower.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

It's pulling air in from that

 

[townfanjon]

They are mains as they got pressure. .

It is being fed by the tank and not mains. And hot water from cylinder.

Confused lol lol

 

[gmartine]

I'm confused, wtf is that cold water feed doing attached to the HW outlet of of the cylinder? DIY job?

 

[Francisco Barros]

When I mentioned mains, I was talking about about the taps and not the shower.

The shower is hot fed from that pipe on the left that comes off that T thing. And cold from the tank in the loft.

 

[Francisco Barros]

I'm confused, wtf is that cold water feed doing attached to the HW outlet of of the cylinder? DIY job?

What cold the two pipes on the left are hot out and the one on the right feeds the tank with cold water.

 

[Francisco Barros]

It's pulling air in from that

Can you explain where the air it’s getting in ?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Can you explain where the air it’s getting in ?

Pulling in via the vent I think

 

[Francisco Barros]

Ok I think I am getting somewhere.
As do only thing that changed was the Nest and having a schedule to come on 6-7am and 17-18pm.

So yesterday set the boiler to always on 24hr ...
And the power shower worked again and this morning still working.

I am confused ‍♂️
Why the power shower only works when always It’s always on???

 

[gmartine]

Get a different plumber to have a look.

 

[rpm]

Err will now have 3 threads on the same problem and you decided to start 2 today
BECAUSE IT WAS GETTING CONFUSING!
😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡

 

[gmartine]

I'm out, this guys a bodger and shouldn't be going anywhere near it.

 

[rpm]

I was only watching but now it`s boring.
Goodbye.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Does this pipe go to the shower?

 

[Harvest Fields]

Can I have a picture of the actual
Shower please

 

[Francisco Barros]

I'm out, this guys a bodger and shouldn't be going anywhere near it.

What a bell end you are , I was just worried that I wasn’t making much sense and today started a new one but on the newbie forum and thought I would get more responde on the plumbing one. I can’t find an option to delete.
Thanks for nothing and your last advice was crap anyway . Get another plumber , no Rubbish Sherlock .

 

[Francisco Barros]

Err will now have 3 threads on the same problem and you decided to start 2 today
BECAUSE IT WAS GETTING CONFUSING!
😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡

Can you delete the others ?

 

[Harvest Fields]

It is only his opinion mate. Don’t take it to heart. No need to be nasty.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Can you delete the others ?

@ShaunCorbs can

 

[Ric2013]

Post deleted as I can't be bothered to try to help someone who is rude on this forum.

 

[Welder]

Post deleted. Echo Ric

 

[Harvest Fields]

It your old age mate😀😀

 

[Francisco Barros]

It is only his opinion mate. Don’t take it to heart. No need to be nasty.

Wasn't he first calling me a bodger ??? how does he comes to such a conclusion just by reading my posts. My bad should only post here.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Does this pipe go to the shower?

View attachment 34551

yes the one with the curve.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Can I have a picture of the actual
Shower please

 

[Harvest Fields]

Would say that it is either the fact the shower can not detect the pressure drop in the supply to switch the pump on or it keeps air locking in the loft? Shower with integral pumps don’t really like up and over pipework.

 

[gmartine]

What a bell end you are , I was just worried that I wasn’t making much sense and today started a new one but on the newbie forum and thought I would get more responde on the plumbing one. I can’t find an option to delete.
Thanks for nothing and your last advice was crap anyway . Get another plumber , no **** Sherlock .

You're welcome, btw it should've been the first advice I gave you since it's clear you know very little...

"- try to bleed the radiator in the bathroom that it’s connected to the hot water system (at least it’s what I think), no luck."

 

[Francisco Barros]

Would say that it is either the fact the shower can not detect the pressure drop in the supply to switch the pump on or it keeps air locking in the loft? Shower with integral pumps don’t really like up and over pipework.

View attachment 34553

Don't if you seen what I posted earlier :

"So I tried different things and found out that if the boiler is left on 24hr (I say on but I believe comes on every time the stat ask for more heat) the shower works.

If is set to come on a couple of hours a day, shower won't work,
to be clear shower works but struggles as very little hot water comes through."

I have a nest where I set the schedules.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Don't if you seen what I posted earlier :

"So I tried different things and found out that if the boiler is left on 24hr (I say on but I believe comes on every time the stat ask for more heat) the shower works.

If is set to come on a couple of hours a day, shower won't work,
to be clear shower works but struggles as very little hot water comes through."

I have a nest where I set the schedules.

When you say Little hot water? Do you mean temperature or flow?

 

[Welder]

Mods. Bell End Emoji pls. Cant wait to apply it here. 😡

 

[Francisco Barros]

When you say Little hot water? Do you mean temperature or flow?

Water - air - water - air - water - air - air

And you can hear the shower struggling because the hot water it’s not getting to the shower. If I turn the dial to more cold, water comes out but still struggles as the won’t let you have just cold.

My issue is, I can’t have the tank heating up only 2/3 hours a day, needs to be always on for it to work.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Where is the shower in relation to the hot water tank?

 

[rpm]

What the eck is going on lately one air in shower pump thread after another and all of them badly piped up.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

@ShaunCorbs can

Done

 

[Francisco Barros]

Where is the shower in relation to the hot water tank?

Same level , cupboard next to bathroom.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Same level , cupboard next to bathroom.

Cut a hole in the wall in the airing cupboard directly behind where the shower is. And pipe the pipe from the cylinder directly into the shower unit.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Cut a hole in the wall in the airing cupboard directly behind where the shower is. And pipe the pipe from the cylinder directly into the shower unit.

Not an option, as I say next to but on the other side .

 

[Francisco Barros]

Mods. Bell End Emoji pls. Cant wait to apply it here. 😡

If I call another plumber and get one with your attitude... I have no chance of getting it fixed.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Fit a standard shower and install a shower pump if the cold tank is big enough

Or go electric

 

[Francisco Barros]

Cut a hole in the wall in the airing cupboard directly behind where the shower is. And pipe the pipe from the cylinder directly into the shower unit.

Thanks for your help but my option is leaving the hot water on 24 hours until I come across a solution.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Same level , cupboard next to bathroom.

So the shower isn’t next to the cupboard?

 

[Francisco Barros]

So the shower isn’t next to the cupboard?

As you come out on the right but it’s the opposite corner on the hall.

Correct me if I am wrong but once the water heats, goes to the top of the cylinder and comes out when I open the tap and the hot/steam/pressure helps it flow.
But the tank it’s only on for a a couple of hours and doesn’t get hot enough ???

Would a Surrey or Essex flange help ?

 

[Harvest Fields]

As you come out on the right but it’s the opposite corner on the hall.

Correct me if I am wrong but once the water heats, goes to the top of the cylinder and comes out when I open the tap and the hot/steam/pressure helps it flow.
But the tank it’s only on for a a couple of hours and doesn’t get hot enough ???

Would a Surrey or Essex flange help ?

Probably not. If it was my house I would do what @ShaunCorbs said and fit a normal mixer shower and an external pump in the cupboard. The shower probably hasn’t worked correctly since it was fitted.

 

[Francisco Barros]

Probably not. If it was my house I would do what @ShaunCorbs said and fit a normal mixer shower and an external pump in the cupboard. The shower probably hasn’t worked correctly since it was fitted.

I actually thought Of it but as I am re-doing the bathroom at a later stage and wanted to get it working .
But i believe will need a bigger tank as the one I have it’s 25 gallon .
Thanks .

 

[Harvest Fields]

Salamander pumps require the tank to be double that size.

 

[Welder]

If I call another plumber and get one with your attitude... I have no chance of getting it fixed.

Its called karma, sweetlips. Good luck.