External Controller Wiring

[IanHoll]

I recently had a Worcestershire Bosch 8000 Lifestyle installed but they also installed the inferior ESI control panel and wireless thermostat. I've just purchased Worcestershire Bosch's CT-200 EasyControl with the RF key. The app is paired with both the RF key and the thermostat and I can see the boiler. However, I cannot control the boiler's settings from the app. I'm guessing it's because I have the old control panel still wired to the boiler which I plan to have disconnected and blanked off.

My question is: would having the COM and N/O still connected on the ESI's receiver and the live returns to the boiler prevent the Worcestershire Bosch EasyControl from being able to control the central heating via the smart app?

Regards,

Ian

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Need to link lr to lr rad and remove the old wiring for the stat

But you shouldn’t be messing around inside the boiler you need to be gas safe

 

[IanHoll]

Thanks for the reply Shaun. I'm just a little baffled to why in the control wall socket there's 2 x neutrals (1 x blue 1 x black), and 2 x red lives when in the boiler's control box I can only see 1 x red live and 1 x blue neutral. I can see the 230v mains ouput already being linked/bridged to the HW and I assume the other wired output goes to the control panel's COM Linked Live Feed which works in conjunction with the N/O to turn on/off the CH when operated by the old controller.

Directly linking/bridging the 230v mains output to the CH's LR seems self-explainatory and I assume I can remove the COM and N/O from the redundant controller's terminals when this is done, but my question is what do I do with the remaining neutrals and lives?

I believe the already disconnected/cutback 4 core cable in the old control panel leads to the now redundant/removed analog wall thermostat's cabling, and I'm guessing the disconnected/cutback 2 x reds possibly has something to do with old cylinder system's pump and actuator. If I do trace the 4 core cable to the redundant thermostat's old location I plan to connect 2 of the cores in to the old COM and N/O cables (when disconnected) so I can connect them to the EMS bus, that will allow me to route a power source for the CT-200 EasyControl to where the old analog thermostat was installed. The location will be perfect as it's in the hallway that leads off to the kitchen, dining room and lounge, so it will provide an average temperature reading, rather than being in a room like the lounge where it's usually warmer.

But back to my main question: what do I do with the 2x neutrals and 2x lives when I can only visible see one of each in the control box?

Cheers

Ian

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Live in eg red boiler live brown
Neutral in eg black boiler neutral blue

Link them together

Sounds like your out of your depth so best to get a pro in

 

[IanHoll]

Oh the joys of being partially colour blind 🙄 What I thought was red was in fact brown. But thanks. I did think they had to remain linked together after removing the backplate. But it's always best to ask the question to be sure.

Cheers

Ian

 

[IanHoll]

Today I removed the com and N/O from the old ESI controller's backplate and linked the boiler's 230v out to the central heating LR terminal. (I only had brown cable to hand but will replace with black). I utilised the now redunant two black cables by linking blue and brown cabling and routed them to the EMS bus which will provide a live feed to the wireless CT-200 thermostat when linked to the old wall mounted analog thermostat's cables. I soldered all connecting wires for maximum conductivity and used heatshrink to insulate. To keep things tidy I also heat shrank together and cable tied the length of blue and brown cable that I had to route outside of the electrical cover from one side to another. This was because of the design of the electrical cover. It doesn't allow you to run cables from one side to another internally. Although you could do it, when closing the cover it fouled the cabling and although the cover would close, it would pinch the cables. Being bad practice and potentially unsafe I routed them externally rather than drilling access within the electrical cover itself.

My only problem now is that when I've probed and toned the 4 core cable that the old wall mounted analog thermostat used, I cannot trace it back to any of the redundant controller backplate's 4 core cables. In fact, as suspected, I can however trace the old wall mounted thermostat's 4 core cabling to within the airing cupboard's wall that previously housed the old cyclinder system, pump and 3-way valve etc.

My questions is: do I now have to gain access from behind the airing cupboard's wall to the consealed old cabling in order to link it togther to what I believe should then give me continuity from the boiler's old controller's panel to the old wall mounted thermostat wiring?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

There should be an old box / blanking plate there in the airing cupboard?

 

[IanHoll]

There should be an old box / blanking plate there in the airing cupboard?

Unfortunately not Shaun. I think the electrician cut off the cabling, pushed it within the cavity of the wall and simply filled its access hole believing the redundant cabling would never be used again.

Of course, I can gain access to the currently redundant cabling by cutting out a small section of the plasterboard walling to access it.

 

[IanHoll]

I'm happy to say it's all done and I've now got a 12v live feed exactly where I want it, being in the hallway where the old Drayton analog wall mounted thermostat was previously installed. As I mentioned earlier, installing the Worcestershire Bosch EasyControl thermostat in the hallway is an optimum place to have a thermostat located. I got the 12v live from the boiler's EMS bus as earlier mentioned.

But yeah, I traced the redundant cables in the airing cupboard and rather than linking everything and burying it all back in the wall cavity I installed a dryline pattress and fished the cabling to it. The cables are now live so it's not only obviously safer having a patress, but I've now also got access to the cabling should I have to every change the configuration later down the line. I know I only had to link two of the cables, but I thought it was better to keep things tidy and everything insulated so save cutting back the unused cable.

It was a lot of work to merely provide a single 12v live feed, but I also didn't like the idea of having redundant cabling buried in the wall when it can serve a purpose.

 

[IanHoll]

Okay, being one year on the fault was still present and hadn't been resolved. So I decided to pay the extra and have my boiler's first service done by Worcestershire Bosch in order to pick the engineer's brains to what he thought the fault could be. After doing the service he investigated. Finding no obvious fault he contacted his tech team for advice, but then suddenly remembered a work collegue spending over 3 hours fixing exactly this problem. The fix? It was simply to remove the RF key from the boiler.

Unknown to me and a lot of people, when you connect an EasyControl thermostat to the boiler's 5v output, the boiler and thermostat use the 2 core cable as both a power and an ethernet cable. Basically, using the same princible as computer homeplugs the boiler and thermostat utilise the existing cabling to transfer data. In short the thermostat was hardwired to the boiler, so having the RF wireless key inserted was creating a conflict and confused the boiler's data processing.

Removing the RF key resolved the issue. Now everthing works flawlessy 🙂

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Yes they do have issues they only like one source of inputs