New Central heating advice

[lackingwedge]

Hi all new member here.

In the process of buying a three-storey Victorian terraced house in wolverhampton.

Currently the property is divided into four flats which i will be converting back into a single property.

Currently flat has an electric immersion heater for hot water and electric storage heaters on the walls.

We will be putting in a central heating system but unsure what type or what vendors to go for this type of property.

We have not decided 100% how many Bathrooms\Showers to have (between two and four) and whether to have.

I have not completely decided on the internal layout when we convert back into a single dwelling, however, an identical property on this terrace has four bedrooms (we plan to squeeze out a Fifth bedroom\small guest room on the first or second floor that will be pretty tiny).

The room sizes are:

Ground floor
Living Room 1 17'6'' ( 5.33m ) x 13' ( 3.96m ) front bay
Living Room 2 15'6'' ( 4.72m ) x 17'9'' ( 5.41m ) rear bay
Rear kitchen extension 38'5'' ( 8.66m ) x 10'5'' ( 3.17m )

First floor
Study 7'7'' ( 2.31m ) x 5'9''
Bedroom 1 17'11'' ( 5.46m ) x 13' ( 3.96m ) front bay
Bedroom 2 13'3'' ( 4.03m ) x 16'7'' ( 5.05m )
Bathroom

Second Floor
Bedroom 3 13'4'' ( 4.06m ) x 17'11'' ( 5.46m )
Bedroom 4 14' ( 4.26m ) x 13'1'' ( 3.98m )
Bathroom

The ground and first floor are high ceillings, whilst the second floor has lower ceilings.

What i need advice on is:

What type of heating\Hot water system required
How many rads required and what sizes
Approx budget as i will need for the hot water, rads as well as piping.

All help appreciated.

 

[Killy Bing]

Yeah....as much as we all love to help out, thats a job for the company quoting.

you can work out your own heat losses.

As for budget that again depends on are you reusing the old systems and joining them up to limp them along.

or ripping it all out and having a properly designed system put in.

once again, the company quoting for the job will do it, regardless, way too little information to help with that.

as for the heating set up i would go for a system boiler with a large unvented cylinder.

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for the response.

I am not expecting a consise answer. As i said, i am in the process of buying the property and just trying to work out budgets for essential pieces of work such as:

Removing stud walls
Rewiring
New Central heating system
Repair\replace windows

That way, i will know what i have left to splash out on non-essentials like:
Garden Lanscaping
New Kitchen
New Bathrooms

Again, i really want to know my options and your recommendation for a boiler\unvented cylinder seems interesting.

Is there a recommended brand that has a good mixture of cost (purchase\installation), reliability and a good support network.
My current property has a Valliant which I have had for 12 years and has not has an issue since install besides turning the screw to repressurise once a year.

A few questions:

Can the cylinder be placed anywhere, or does it need to be in the top floor.
I plan to have one bath and two to three showers. Can these all be run simultaneously off the system at a high pressure or do you recommend at least one electric shower?

 

[Ermintrude]

Fit underfloor heating on ground floor and in bathrooms.

Don't install concrete floors they will cause damp. U should use a suspended celotex sheet between joists and biscuit mix on top below floor boards.

Rads in bed rooms should be on zones to optimise heat use.


Fit a SLME cylinder so that you can fit solar at a later date.

I would install cylinder and boiler where convenient, where you had the most space. Upgrade from lead to 32mm water supply.

Insulate insulate insulate . Even between floors.

 

[Whyme]

it all depends on what you want to spend. underfloor heating has an initial cost but gains in the long term. radiators are easier to fit and there much the same (btw column rads lokk nice but are next to useless). an unvented cylinder can be put anywhere but in the middle of the house is best because the hw draw offs are shorter ie no long runs of pipe before the hot water gets to your taps ect.

 

[Killy Bing]

As per ermi. If you want multiple hot take offs your two options are an unvented cylinder or a commercial boiler!

commercial boiler wont be an option so unvented it is.

An unvented cylinder requires a good water pressure and flow rate to run.

flow rate can be increased with a larger incoming pipe, as ermi says 32mm would be ideal.

while you're renovating remove the lead incoming main and upgrade now.

pressure is dictated by the area.

pay a consultancy fee to a local heating engineer to attend to check suitability before you buy the house and have a general look at the state of the plumbing.

there is a looking for a plumber section on here.
good to use as we all give our time freely so we tend to know our stuff!!

 

[Ermintrude]

Column rads useless ? I've got about. 18kw worth upstairs in my house, they work beautifully.

They look a lot better than convectors they do require a bit more cleaning but won't ever be fitting a panel rad in any of my dwellings.

 

[Whyme]

Column rads useless ? I've got about. 18kw worth upstairs in my house, they work beautifully.

They look a lot better than convectors they do require a bit more cleaning but won't ever be fitting a panel rad in any of my dwellings.

they never work better than convectors though..

 

[TBServices]

they never work better than convectors though..

Who's to say that? As long as they're the right size for the room, they heat it up, and you're willing to pay more £££ per KW, it's down to personal choice.

Some see rads as a feature, others choose to ignore their existence.

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Be look at a budget of at least 10K + for the heating and hot water 🙂

 

[happyflyer]

Be look at a budget of at least 10K + for the heating and hot water 🙂

IDCHAPPY,

I think you might be close to the mark with the + bit, just for the heating not the rest of the plumbing, this is a big house big heat losses too,
the running costs will be high.

 

[Ermintrude]

Insulate and lots of zone valves

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for the advice.

A few points....
With regards to underfloor heating, is electric recommended or a water based system plumbed into the central heating system?

Also, is electric flooring enough to sufficiently heat a room or will it need to be supplemented with Rads (I am thinking of the large kitchen here). I am happy to have it in the bathrooms.

I plan to install thick carpets in all the rooms besides the kitchen and bathrooms. Is underfloor heating an option for that?

When you say zones for Rads, are you refering to TRV's and have different levels in different rooms?

I googled an SLME cylinder. How much extra does solar add to the whole project and are the gains worth it, or should i just purchase the compatible cylinder and then Solar at a later date when the costs fall?

I hear the stuff about insulation, however I have heard of issues when you over-insulate Victorian properties and condensation issues.

Thanks for the advice regarding costs. I had thought about 10K all in as worst case.

 

[Ermintrude]

Electric underfloor is only for warming tiles not heating a room.

I would install zone valves and programmers to each room or at least each cluster, master and ensuite ? This means this cluster can come on at different time and temp to other rooms it will save you in long run. Trvs are low tech the electronic trvs are a bit gimmicky too. Do it properly or just have an ash tray to burn money in.

Insulation with a vapour control is excellent. My house was built in 1802 and has 100mm of celotex and an internal vented cavity

100mm celotex in floors ( internal as well as ground floor)

150mm in pitched warm roof.

Main thing is ventilation.

You need a wholistic plan. You will need to drive this. All the trades will do their thing and you will probably be missing all sorts.

1 stop, look and plan what you want.
2 research - not from builder but books and internet

3 local building control- tell them what your planning and ask for a visit as you want to comply with building regs.

4 interview trades.

5 plan and schedule

6 check

7 get started


I would recommend you look at insulation products and literature on tinternet.

Interstitial condensation - your first google exploration

Oh solar. Yes it will be worth it depending on aspect of roof and the available area. £5k to £15k rhi grants available you should contact an mcs registered installer for this before you make any choices.

If the cylinder is accessible from roof then it can be done later ( need to run plant from cylinder to roof)

SLME is a mutil energy tank - it's the best one on the market.

 

[Irish]

Electric underfloor is only for warming tiles not heating a room.

I would install zone valves and programmers to each room or at least each cluster, master and ensuite ? This means this cluster can come on at different time and temp to other rooms it will save you in long run. Trvs are low tech the electronic trvs are a bit gimmicky too. Do it properly or just have an ash tray to burn money in.

Insulation with a vapour control is excellent. My house was built in 1802 and has 100mm of celotex and an internal vented cavity

100mm celotex in floors ( internal as well as ground floor)

150mm in pitched warm roof.

Main thing is ventilation.

You need a wholistic plan. You will need to drive this. All the trades will do their thing and you will probably be missing all sorts.

1 stop, look and plan what you want.
2 research - not from builder but books and internet

3 local building control- tell them what your planning and ask for a visit as you want to comply with building regs.

4 interview trades.

5 plan and schedule

6 check

7 get started


I would recommend you look at insulation products and literature on tinternet.

Interstitial condensation - your first google exploration

Oh solar. Yes it will be worth it depending on aspect of roof and the available area. £5k to £15k rhi grants available you should contact an mcs registered installer for this before you make any choices.

If the cylinder is accessible from roof then it can be done later ( need to run plant from cylinder to roof)

SLME is a mutil energy tank - it's the best one on the market.

Nuff said!!

 

[IDCHAPPY]

IDCHAPPY,

I think you might be close to the mark with the + bit, just for the heating not the rest of the plumbing, this is a big house big heat losses too,
the running costs will be high.

Yeah, that's why i also used at least 😉

 

[Centralheatking]

Hi lackingwedge

You have landed at the best Plumbing & Heating Forum - we are all experts and like to help
and give our time for free

Simple problems are sorted out on here instantly because we are collectively very good at what we do.

To design and spec up a dev which you have asked about will involve a number of issues

1. You will need to present to us some plans inc room sizes etc
2. Then online we can only speculate
3. However you might find a really good a trusted installer on here to help in your local area
4. But take notice - my friends on UKPF are not cheap - but we are also fair

Reply with some plans etc and you might find a way fwds .........Chk

.lmereweating

Hi all new member here.

In the process of buying a three-storey Victorian terraced house in wolverhampton.

Currently the property is divided into four flats which i will be converting back into a single property.

Currently flat has an electric immersion heater for hot water and electric storage heaters on the walls.

We will be putting in a central heating system but unsure what type or what vendors to go for this type of property.

We have not decided 100% how many Bathrooms\Showers to have (between two and four) and whether to have.

I have not completely decided on the internal layout when we convert back into a single dwelling, however, an identical property on this terrace has four bedrooms (we plan to squeeze out a Fifth bedroom\small guest room on the first or second floor that will be pretty tiny).

The room sizes are:

Ground floor
Living Room 1 17'6'' ( 5.33m ) x 13' ( 3.96m ) front bay
Living Room 2 15'6'' ( 4.72m ) x 17'9'' ( 5.41m ) rear bay
Rear kitchen extension 38'5'' ( 8.66m ) x 10'5'' ( 3.17m )

First floor
Study 7'7'' ( 2.31m ) x 5'9''
Bedroom 1 17'11'' ( 5.46m ) x 13' ( 3.96m ) front bay
Bedroom 2 13'3'' ( 4.03m ) x 16'7'' ( 5.05m )
Bathroom

Second Floor
Bedroom 3 13'4'' ( 4.06m ) x 17'11'' ( 5.46m )
Bedroom 4 14' ( 4.26m ) x 13'1'' ( 3.98m )
Bathroom

The ground and first floor are high ceillings, whilst the second floor has lower ceilings.

What i need advice on is:

What type of heating\Hot water system required
How many rads required and what sizes
Approx budget as i will need for the hot water, rads as well as piping.

All help appreciated.

 

[Killy Bing]

This is looking to be quite a tasty project actually!

you could go for the entire ground floor as underfloor heating and have all the upstairs radiators from a manifold system.

This would afford you individual room controls throughout the entire house if you wished 🙂

 

[AWheating]

id say its looking alot more than 10k with bathrooms etc.......

you will want to use that 5th bedroom as a cupboard for all the kit.

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for the replies. I'm due to complete in the next 3 weeks. Can anyone recommend a trusted heating engineer in the Wolverhampton area?

 

[Centralheatking]

Come on you lot its a good lookin project - if he has the dosh get in there
OTHERWISE CENTRALHEATKING and my really expert team of fitters from
Liverpool will make friends with this chap ...........my email is ...........
in fact we might fly Cropp into west midland aport as ...what ur choice

CHk

 

[Gray0689]

This is looking to be quite a tasty project actually!

you could go for the entire ground floor as underfloor heating and have all the upstairs radiators from a manifold system.

This would afford you individual room controls throughout the entire house if you wished 🙂

This is the way to go
But 10k is unrealistic

You pay peanuts you get monkeys I'm afraid

 

[lackingwedge]

Anyone, I am finally completng next next week and with have my architect in to draw floorplans etc the week after. Anyone fancy coming into discuss quotes and options?

 

[lackingwedge]

This site for some reason is not allowing my to post a link of the property on rightmove (help admins??)
I will be converting from 4 flats back into a single dwelling so so some of the water and waste pipes will have to be capped (as we do not need so many kitchens and bathrooms) as well as a new central heating system.
I don't have a fixed budget, I believe that things like Windows, Roofs and Central heating are best done once and properly even if you spend a little bit more as you don't really want to be messing around with it 5-10 years down the line.

With regard to the central heating, i would be interested in a specialist discussing the options discussed in the thread and quoting me for the work.

 

[happyflyer]

See who needs to advertise when you can pick up work from this site, nice, sort the man out, if I was 30 again I would be in there.

 

[lackingwedge]

See who needs to advertise when you can pick up work from this site, nice, sort the man out, if I was 30 again I would be in there.

🙂

I guess you guys are making too much money to bother with lil old me.

 

[Gray0689]

🙂

I guess you guys are making too much money to bother with lil old me.

I'm sorry there is no one around to help you out
I'm not sure of anyone in your area


So how many bathrooms are you putting in
What would you like to do
Ie control wise

 

[Ermintrude]

I'm sorry I'm not about would have done u a top job and price to suit!

 

[TBServices]

🙂

I guess you guys are making too much money to bother with lil old me.

It may be your location that's the problem LW. Where are you?

 

[Masood]

It may be your location that's the problem LW. Where are you?

Wolverhampton, TB.

Guys, I've done a couple of jobs for Robert in his London house. He's not unrealistic about budget, or the amount of work required. He's a clued-up guy who wants a decent job done. Can nobody help him out? A bit far for me otherwise I'd be up for it...

 

[Ermintrude]

Yam yam wooooooverhampton

 

[AWheating]

send me a private message and i will be able to arrange to come take a look give you advise and a quote.

 

[lackingwedge]

PM sent.

 

[lackingwedge]

As for bathrooms:
1. One on second floor
2. Two En-suites on first floor

I will be putting in Lightwave RF throughout the house which includes individuall Rad Thermostats which will allow me to control the temperature of each radiator individually or by Zones so Will not need additional zones or manifolds plumbed in?

I am open to underfloor heating on the ground floor at least.

 

[happyflyer]

As for bathrooms:
1. One on second floor
2. Two En-suites on first floor

I will be putting in Lightwave RF throughout the house which includes individuall Rad Thermostats which will allow me to control the temperature of each radiator individually or by Zones so Will not need additional zones or manifolds plumbed in?

I am open to underfloor heating on the ground floor at least.

Wow,

Lightwave RF throughout the house, tell us more please???

 

[Ermintrude]

Ohhh don't. Fit standard two ports and prog stats or address the two ports and run via ip .

Ufh is excellent. If you do fit ufh oversize your rads by 150% then boiler runs cooler but house same temp also works better with weather comp and alternate energy in future as lower density heat req. if u can afford it wet ufh in bathrooms / will require biscuit job tho. Don't use spreaders house will sound like enamel bath in a hail storm of m10 nuts

 

[lackingwedge]

Hi, Just posted a long reply and then my internet went haywire when i tried to submit.

I have lightwave RF in my current (smaller) property for all my light switches and power sockets. I also have their TRV's. This allow me individualy controls to all light\wall\radiator sockets that I can control using an app on my phone.

I can also pair the TRV's with a thermostat, but I tired this and got rid.

The trv's have day\night summer\winter temperatures as well as a holiday mode.

They work well for me as in the winter,m I will set the downstairs rads to a higher temperature and the upstairs ones a few C lower.

"Fit standard two ports and prog stats or address the two ports and run via ip"
Sorry, i'm not in the "trade" so don't really know what this means.

"weather comp"
Dito

"will require biscuit job tho"

This neither, help with plumbers lingo would be much appreciated 🙂

 

[Ermintrude]

Two port is a valve, it's a lot more, reliable, durable and easier to replace. Does your current isystem give you real time feedback on temps?

Weather compensation. Basically makes your heating water temperature inversely proportional to outside temp. So when it's cold boiler works harder but when warm not so hard. - energy saving.

Biscuit mix . Light sand and cement screed on a celotex support to give thermal mass to a suspended floor underfloor heating job.

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for the reply.
Currently there is no central heating system in place. The property is currently 4 one bedroomed flats that I will be converting back into a single dwelling. all flats have storage heaters as well as electric water immersion cylinders.

There is no GAS into the property (this was capped off at the entrance when they were converted 30 odd years ago).

 

[Killy Bing]

First thing to do is get the ball rolling on getting that connection back on. Will be your cheapest form of heating tbh.

unless you feel like being all eco !!!

 

[Ermintrude]

I would look at what your doing with all those controls and save a few ££. Then buy yourself a decent solar array of thermal units . A nice big ACV SLME cylinder and a klover stove and let HMRC pay you for a change.

Before you get back on the gas look at RHI and what might suit you .

 

[lackingwedge]

Not sure what I can do solar wise as my property is in a conservation area.

 

[Ermintrude]

You can get solar that is flush with roof so most councils can't quibble. Unless it's listed

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for that, worth exploring with the heating engineers who come and give me a quote 🙂

 

[Worcester]

Solar is usually a permitted development even within conservation areas, UNLESS you have specifically had your permitted development rights specifiacally removed.

or:
"in the case of land within a conservation area or which is a World Heritage Site, the solar PV or solar thermal equipment would be installed on a wall which fronts a highway;"

i.e if you put it on a roof or a wall and it projects less than 200mm from that surface you are OK (even though they don't like to admit it and try to charge you for permission letters 🙂 )

Planning Portal - Solar Panels

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks for the reply.

Just seen this. is there a chance i am eligable for a payout if i fit a solar panel or two?

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmen...ing-systems-domestic-renewable-heat-incentive

 

[Worcester]

IF designed, installed and commissioned by an MCS certified installer to meet the MCS and RHI regs then Oh YES! 🙂

There are a number of catches with the DomRHI and there are a number of specific things that have to be done during the design and installation stage to make a Solar Thermal system eligible for the DomRHI, becasue of this a lot of legacy installations aren't eligible.

We spent days researching and learning all the catches, there again, that's our business 🙂

(You could find out for yourself too - just read the 10 x 40 page documents available from ofgem! - and you still need to employ an MCS certified company to do all the work anyway..)

 

[lackingwedge]

Sounds like it will be difficult to qualify for this...

 

[Worcester]

It's very simple, we do it all the time. You cannot 'do-it-yourself' though, as the govt need to ensure it is designed and installed to be efficient and effective. The DomRHI payments and greater efficiency will more than make up for the additional cost of engaging a professional organisation.

 

[happyflyer]

Lackinwedge,

Have you not finished it yet, hell you OP was Jan.

 

[lackingwedge]

No Happyflyer.
Only completed on the purchase a couple of weeks ago due to the usual house buying crap that comes up and tests one's patience.

I have a few people coming in to quote me over the next week including someone from this parish.
Still not sure exactly what kind of system i will be putting in but the advice here is invaluable for Ideas which I can get quoted on and help me make an informed choice.

 

[Worcester]

Wolverhampton isn't too far from us 🙂 If you ask..

 

[lackingwedge]

Ok, I have been thinking about renewables and done some reading up on it.
Can someone confirm whether my thinking on this is right or put me right where i have misunderstood?

Firstly I would have to follow the insulation recommendations on the green deal assessment thingmy done by an improved assessor?

I was already planning on doing the following [FONT=verdana, geneva, lucida, lucida grande, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Insulation:[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, lucida, lucida grande, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] Internal solid wall to all external walls, loft insulation, insulation in between floors, insulation on concrete floors,secondary glazing I live in conservation area so doubt i will be allowed to swap any single pane to Double Glazing at a reasonable cost.
[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, lucida, lucida grande, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Is this something worth persueing with the grant system. I plan to get my builder to quote me on the insulation and compare to Green deal registered offer. If my builder can do for a much cheaper price, will that invalidate the RHI if I plan for a renewable energy systems like Air\Ground source, Solar Water?
[/FONT]According to this site here.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/294533/Cashback.pdf
I can get a grenat to cover the cost of some or all of my proposed insulation work?

Secondly: Underfloor heating with Air source heat pump. I know this will be a premium cost upfront over standard boiler\unvented cylinder with RADS and zone valves but with the lower running costs and RHI cashback, it should pay for itself within a few years?

To, qualify, it just needs to be installed and commission by an MCS registered installer, I fill out a form and a cheque comes in through the post every quarter as long as I implement the energy saving recommendation is my green deal assessment (insulation, secondary glazing etc...)?

Looking at the EPCs for my property:

https://www.epcregister.com/direct/report/8606-8026-6729-8196-2173
https://www.epcregister.com/direct/report/9728-1019-7251-1137-7940
https://www.epcregister.com/direct/report/8277-7727-0870-6544-0906
https://www.epcregister.com/direct/report/0353-2882-6114-9097-0685

my combined heat demand will be 41677!!

Looking on the government RHI website here (page 28)
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/ofgem-publications/87121/essentialguideforapplicantsweb.pdf
would suggest that my RHI payments would be around £1900 per year.

Are my calculations right?


I am bleeding confused already. 🙁

 

[happyflyer]

Look just get a man to get a few rads and a boiler your digging a deep hole for yourself, who gives a toss about all this tosh, you just need a bit of heat in winter
as long as you are not heating all of Wolverhampton, it don't matter. were up to 53 post and not a brew made, a rad on a wall, and the first mortgage payment made, its not good enough this, we never had all this tosh when I was a lad, its gone regulation mad, and I will bet you will never get an inspector near your place. Get down B&Q lots of goodies there.
BTW don't forget to get a GSR to fit it all..

 

[happyflyer]

BTW does Lackinawedge mean you are a bit on the short of cash ????

 

[lackingwedge]

Thanks Happy flyer.
I don't have any system at all in my house and just looking at all options so that I can make an informed choice.
I am moving from a modern 1980's house with Cavity wall insulation, loft insulation and full double glazing to a victorian property about 3 times the size with solid wall insulation, leaving windows and has seen little maintenance over the last 25 years.

I grew up in a similar sized property and can remember how draughty and the nocicable temperature drop the further away from the Rads you moved. Not to mention the amount of 50p's the Gas meter would consume if you turned on the central heating. God knows how much that house would cost to heat now.

 

[lackingwedge]

Lackingwedge means I wish to renovate my house with a restrictive budget.
However, if convinced, i am prepared to make the capital outlay if I can get RHI\insulation cashback from the government and lower utility bills.

If I was a mind to go down to B&Q, fill my trolly with copper, a dozen rads, a boiler and a tank, I would not bother with this site.
However, if that is the expert opinion of the expert heating engineers here, then that's what I would do.

 

[Ermintrude]

I have seen lots and lots of the solid wall insulation jobs at a standstill due to running out of money.

By all means apply for green steal. But don't pay upfront for anything as they will just take you for a ride.

I have a three story Victorian house, I bought seconds of celotex from eBay. I bought 2 lorry loads at £1000 a pop. Something like a million sheets of 100mm.

I dry lined whole house with a ventilated gap behind insulation of 50mm. All foil walls , 99% air tight as all the studs and foil sheets were covered with foil tape.

Celotex in ceilings again 100% vapour barrier and the ground floor I removed the concrete and excavated 350mm and then built a suspended timber floor with 100mm celotex between them and then out wet ufh on top of it.

My loft has a lot of insulation too. It's a warm roof.


I don't think your builder or the green deal will take as much care with insulation.


Your heating system?


Defo ufh ground and bathrooms

Rads on zones above ff.


Unvented.


Don't think ashp is what u really need when on a budget. Solar thermal for your DHW.

Use a decent unvented ACV SL or similar. Pipe your house so that a everything comes back to a "low Loss headder"

Have two spare ports so that an alternative heat unit can be added into system at a later date but for now just hook up a gas boiler / if you can't afford the whole Hogg

Oversize your rads by the same amount say factor of 2 .

I would make the system as versatile as possible .

Get Worcester round to have a look he's the main man

 

[happyflyer]

Ermi,

This is going to cost him more than the hoose, think he needs the chap from Grand Design, MC.Cloud they always run out of money in the end, he will be lackin-a-wedge then, come on here for advice and go bankrupt, does he know what he has taken on I wonder, maybe he would have been better down at B&Q like I said, met the chap in the isles at B&Q and get his advice there. Anyway whatever he does its photos before and after we need. No one ever comes back on here and thanks us, sometimes I don't know why we bother.

The Worcester man is a good idea, oversize rads yes, I could commission witness his dual fuel rotary cup burner on the Babbcock & Willcocks boiler in the back yard.

Good luck to him hope he sorts it.

 

[lackingwedge]

I forgot to mention, I am planning to get thick carpet and underlay in most bedrooms. Does this preclude UFH as i know that the maximum tog of a carpet and underlay should not exceed 2.1 tog. The underlay i am looking at it 2Tog on its own (cloud 9).

 

[Ermintrude]

Rads in bedrooms!

 

[Killy Bing]

If you want it that thick then have radiators, sod all point of having ufh.

if you're having them for sound proofing then invest in floor stuff.

 

[lackingwedge]

Thick carpet is currently wifey's preference rather than for soundprooofing, this is of course subject to change.......

 

[happyflyer]

Rads in bedrooms!

Yes please don't put UFH upstairs you will never get to the service below it.

 

[Gray0689]

I have seen lots and lots of the solid wall insulation jobs at a standstill due to running out of money.

By all means apply for green steal. But don't pay upfront for anything as they will just take you for a ride.

I have a three story Victorian house, I bought seconds of celotex from eBay. I bought 2 lorry loads at £1000 a pop. Something like a million sheets of 100mm.

I dry lined whole house with a ventilated gap behind insulation of 50mm. All foil walls , 99% air tight as all the studs and foil sheets were covered with foil tape.

Celotex in ceilings again 100% vapour barrier and the ground floor I removed the concrete and excavated 350mm and then built a suspended timber floor with 100mm celotex between them and then out wet ufh on top of it.

My loft has a lot of insulation too. It's a warm roof.


I don't think your builder or the green deal will take as much care with insulation.


Your heating system?


Defo ufh ground and bathrooms

Rads on zones above ff.


Unvented.


Don't think ashp is what u really need when on a budget. Solar thermal for your DHW.

Use a decent unvented ACV SL or similar. Pipe your house so that a everything comes back to a "low Loss headder"

Have two spare ports so that an alternative heat unit can be added into system at a later date but for now just hook up a gas boiler / if you can't afford the whole Hogg

Oversize your rads by the same amount say factor of 2 .

I would make the system as versatile as possible .

Get Worcester round to have a look he's the main man

Ermi where you get the seconds insulation at that price I need a lot of it

 

[Ray Stafford]

Ermi where you get the seconds insulation at that price I need a lot of it

Me too.

 

[lackingwedge]

Ermi where you get the seconds insulation at that price I need a lot of it

+1 I would like some too

 

[Ermintrude]

eBay. It's the one in Wales . His name is rob, call up negotiate and your away. Weekly drops to the north easy. Bought mine 6 years ago! He will bond it to plasterboard even double thickness.

 

[lackingwedge]

Ermintrude, would need a bit more info than that as I cannot find this guy on Ebay

 

[Ermintrude]

A&A insulation 01443 209585

Or the main man
Robbie 07717805726

I didn't give anyone his number and it's a need to know basis.

 

[Ermintrude]

Ermintrude, would need a bit more info than that as I cannot find this guy on Ebay

Sorry I'm starting to think you're stupid. What did you type into eBay?

I got the above details by typing "well insulated sheep shaggier seconds"

 

[spanner]

A decent system boiler and an unvented hot water cylinder sited in the middle of the property landing somewhere as Killy Bing stated
But the opinions for prices I've non of any ideas

 

[Worcester]

Try these as well: Insulation Boards

Just spent the day at Stiebel Eltron, they have a nice range of fan assisted rads for heat pumps, not quite as stylish as the Dimplex ones though a good solid brand, with much better support and backup.

Designing for a heat pump, at a flow temp of 40° the rads need to be 4.3 times bigger than with a delta T of 50° ! So fan assisted definitely helps.

 

[wetdrip]

Why Wolverhampton?

 

[happyflyer]

This is like The Sound Of Music, or The Great Escape. 72 post now and not a bed made.

 

[Ermintrude]

Omg Worcester / Gordon I always thought you were a nice sensible chap, "forced convection rads" horrid nosey dusty rubbish. May as well just go warm air and be done with it.

 

[lackingwedge]

Some pictures of the floorplan.
The large open space at the back of the house has not been fully knocked out yet and will be divided into two living spaces as well as a downstairs toilet and utility.

There will be 1 bathroom with a bath as well as a shower. another ensuite on the first floor with a shower as well as a shower room on the second floor.

Conservation officer coming today so should know what my limitations are.

 

[happyflyer]

Conservation officer coming today so should know what my limitations are

Effectively the job is now stopped, conservation officer in Wolverhampton are you sure, have they got one. 77 posts and not a pot washed, Chinese Knot weed, bats and newts all you need now is a tree huger, send us the postcode and we will Google map it see if the lads can throw some light on it for you, if you knocked it down and rebuilt it do you think anyone from the Corpo would notice.

 

[lackingwedge]

On the contrary Happyflyer.

He only said that we should not replace any of our existing wooden windows to UPVC. I just though it prudent see approval rather than do what i want and then have the council servicing me orders to remove stuff and threatening all kinds of action. If that makes me stupid, then so be it.


I can see that me posting on this site is starting to annoy you so I will stop posting and asking questions.
Thanks to everyone who has provided good advice to a member of the public who just wanted advice from experts.

 

[happyflyer]

On the contrary Happyflyer.

He only said that we should not replace any of our existing wooden windows to UPVC. I just though it prudent see approval rather than do what i want and then have the council servicing me orders to remove stuff and threatening all kinds of action. If that makes me stupid, then so be it.


I can see that me posting on this site is starting to annoy you so I will stop posting and asking questions.
Thanks to everyone who has provided good advice to a member of the public who just wanted advice from experts.

On the contrary do not stop posting is very few times we see someone get to the end and come back and tell us how it all went its just I am 70 this year and don't know if I will see you completed at this rate, I want you to get a move on and start making some decisions please, lets see some action winter is coming

Tony

 

[Gray0689]

On the contrary Happyflyer.

He only said that we should not replace any of our existing wooden windows to UPVC. I just though it prudent see approval rather than do what i want and then have the council servicing me orders to remove stuff and threatening all kinds of action. If that makes me stupid, then so be it.


I can see that me posting on this site is starting to annoy you so I will stop posting and asking questions.
Thanks to everyone who has provided good advice to a member of the public who just wanted advice from experts.

Post away and ask as many questions as you like that's what the forum is for and most are glad to help

 

[lackingwedge]

I completed on the property 4 weeks ago.
It was four flats and is being converted to a single dwelling.

I have been working on getting the Gas main turned back on (will need a trench being dug from the main road to my house) as well as the stud walls being knocked out and deciding on the new room configuration (we are now to move the location of the kitchen.

I did asked numerous times and it took an intervention from a member of this board before anyone here even agreed to come (post 30).

Also, alot of stuff has been mentioned here that I have never heard of before. Like most punters, my knowledge of central heating only goes as far as a boiler and some radiators. I knew little of solid wall insulation, Under floor heating, ASHP, Unvented boilers, Solar Water and PV, Green Deal, RHI payback etc.

All this information is quite overwhelming and is taking me some time to digest.

 

[lackingwedge]

On the contrary do not stop posting is very few times we see someone get to the end and come back and tell us how it all went its just I am 70 this year and don't know if I will see you completed at this rate, I want you to get a move on and start making some decisions please, lets see some action winter is coming

Tony

I need to have a quote before i make a decision............

 

[Ermintrude]

Ignore the baldy organ playing git! More posts that annoy him the better!

 

[happyflyer]

Ignore the baldy organ playing git! More posts that annoy him the better!

Woooh how many likes can I give you for this bonny lad :reddevil:

 

[happyflyer]

I need to have a quote before i make a decision............

Will one of you chaps give this lad a price, looks like he's got some 3D drawings, to scale too!!!

 

[Ermintrude]

Ha ha ha ! I'm fussing 10k

 

[IDCHAPPY]

How the funk has this thread reached 8 pages? :lol:

 

[happyflyer]

How the funk has this thread reached 8 pages? :lol:

8??? 88 because ID we have been giving mixed messages, left hand doesn't know what right is doing

 

[lackingwedge]

Room sizes to accompany the drawings

The window sizes are in inches. sizes in brackets are in M.







Room height:


Back of house - 2.40m/7f 10


Front of house - 3.25m/10f 8





Doors and windows in inches:





Ground floor:


Front door - 80 x 70


Front living room - 87 x 113 (2.41x3.13)


Back living room - 78 x 102

(2.1x2.83)


Hall - 44 x 83 (1.2x2.3)


Back portion of the house - x2@ 42 x 47 (1.6x1.3)/ x2@ 43 x 21 (1.19x.58) / 46 x 46 (1.27x1.27)/ 46 x 67 (1.27x1.86)


Back door - 80 x 69 (2.2x1.9)





First floor:


Landing - 67 x 41 (1.86x1.6)


Front bedroom - 67 x 65 (1.86x1.80) & 30 x 14 (0.83x0.38) (En-suite - 50 x 30 (1.38x0.83))


Back bedroom - 70 x 58 (1.94x1.61) (En-suite - 51 x 55 (1.41x1.52)





Second Floor:


Landing - 40 x 47 (1.11x1.30)


Back bedroom - 35 x 63 (0.97x1.75)


Front bedroom - 45 x 65 (1.25x1.80)


bathroom - 45 x 58 (1.25x1.61)





Floors




Front living room - 13.3 (4.04) x 16.5 (5.48)

Rear living room - 17.11 (5.53) x 13.11 (4.25)



First Floor



Front bedroom - 16.11 (5.15) x 13.3 (4.03)

Front ensuite - 6.5 (1.96) x 5.10 (1.79)



Rear bedroom - 18.0 (5.49) x 13.3 (4.05)

Rear ensuite - 10.9 (3.27) x 6.11 (2.10)



Second Floor



Rear bedroom - 13.5 (4.08) x 16.7 (5.06)

Rear bedroom - 17.10 (5.43) x 13.5 (4.10)

Bathroom - 7 (2.12) x 7 (2.13)



Ground Floor




Double bedroom - 10.10 (3.07) x 11.10 (3.60)


Single bedroom/living dining - 19.1 (5.82) x 10.6 (3.21)


Kitchen - cellar - 35.6 (10.81) x 10.6 (3.21)

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Is this a free design service?

 

[lackingwedge]

I would buy you a beer IDchappy but Scotland is too far and way too cold for me :26:

 

[Ermintrude]

I go by my other tag "grands design. " un like grand designs I won't do a design for less than a few grand- hence the name

 

[happyflyer]

Ignore the baldy organ playing git! More posts that annoy him the better!

The baldy organ on the keys prepared this one earlier for you Ermi keep you smiling, must practice more

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cidiawjl8jcpcb1/when your smiling.wav