New members question

[Andrew Archer]

Hi I have recently got myself a house in France and want to renovate it from the ground up, we have done the roof and electric and now comes the plumbing....we are planning to have the upstairs/loft as one big open room with toilet and free standing bath....no room for cold water tanks or hot water storage tanks...

I am hoping to have the heart of the plumbing in the small cellar below the down stairs bathroom as this is close to the kitchen and almost directly under where the bath is due to go....running the central heating and hot water will be a solid fuel range, esse or Rayburn style.

is it possible to have a sealed/ pressurised system in the cellar that can run hot water and central heating?
the cellar is below ground, ground floor will have the wood burning cooker providing the heat for water and heating, first floor is the open plan bathroom and bedroom.

I did a city and guilds plumbing course when I left the Royal Air Force 8 years ago and have done a lot of bathroom and kitchen work but never tackled anything like this...please help...many thanks in advance.

 

[WHPES]

Yes, you would need the range providing heat to an open vented thermal store which has an indirect secondary coil going through it which you could link to a sealed heating system. (i.e heating water and thermal store water are separate). Thermal stores can be made to order depending on what configuration you require.

Laws of physics apply of course so there's absolutely no way getting round not having the store above the range - heat rises so the store needs to be above the height of the range so you may need to put it on the floor above and box it in. Everything else can go in your baseement. You need to ensure the floor you put the store on is strong enough to support the weight. You will also need a thermal loading valve (eg Laddomat) for it to heat the water efficiently and prevent corrosion and premature failure of the range.

The thermal store would be plumbed in the usual way (small F&E cistern on top, heat leak rad, associated controls and Domestic Hot Water supply and draw off with heat exchanger, flow switch etc). Of course, regional regulations apply so speak to your local Building Control dept.

 

[Killy Bing]

Best to just do the central heating from the back boiler imho
have a direct unvented cylinder for the hot water.
common practice in france.

 

[Ermintrude]

Thermal store in parallel with a heating and uvhss . Works a treat u need a few valves pump and a brain. Back it up with a gas system boiler and mix in some solar and get the RHI for the DHW from the solar?

 

[Worcester]

Thermal store in parallel with a heating and uvhss . Works a treat u need a few valves pump and a brain. Back it up with a gas system boiler and mix in some solar and get the RHI for the DHW from the solar?

It's in France .... don't know what their RHI policy is 🙂

 

[Worcester]

Also there are some systems that CAN be used with an unvented thermal store - they are especially certificated / designed and have a raft of extra safety controls added and built in, it is not so uncommon abroad to do this.

The safety on the stove is is down to the fact that the chamber around the fireboxes is open vented and stays where it is at all times. The heating circ / thermal store is run through a coil within the chamber as a sealed system. This means that the open vent can boil away with no issues as the sealed side has a higher boiling point.

Basically it runs the stove open-vented locally within itself.

 

[SimonG]

Not familiar with any regs in France, you will probably be able to get away with anything, but need to check any local requirements. No neighbours etc who havexsomething similar?