Plumbing Material Costs

[theskiingbear]

I need some help please. We are having a bathroom and a wc fitted out. The plumbers are on a day rate plus reimbursement for plumbing sundries. The bill for sundries comes to £1200. We have had 2 toilets fitted (one toilet had a new soil vent, the other didnt), a free standing bath and free standing taps, a shower tray and associated plumbing, a wall mounted towel rail and a bathroom subfloor fitted (12mm ply and tongue and groove floorboards), 3 sinks. I have all the receipts but they mean absolutely nothing to me, bar the copper piping (6m) and chrome piping (3m). The bathroom is 3 x 4m and the WC is literally a cloak room, small. How does this sound?

 

[Resolute]

All depends on what they've brought. Like anything you can spend as much or as little as you like. Doesn't sound extortionate though and if the receipts add up then they aren't ripping you off IMO.

 

[theskiingbear]

I just dont understand what they have bought as the content of the receipts mean nothing to me. Any suggestions on how I can check that all the stuff bought has been used for our job?

 

[mark.brazenor@b]

If they've brought all of that then not too bad at all.

Why don't you trust them, they've given you the receipts if they had any thing to hide then they wouldn't. it's normal (and acceptable) practice to add upto a 30% markup, which it doesn't sound like they've done. I'd be careful before you **** them off going through the receipts with them.

 

[stevetheplumber]

it sounds to cheap to me free standing baths and taps alone can come to that

 

[theskiingbear]

it sounds to cheap to me free standing baths and taps alone can come to that

The cost is not for any hardware, just the plumbing materials eg solvent weld waste pipes, 32mm knuckle bends, reducers, tee's etc. Thats why I'm questioning it as it seems like a high cost for supplies considering the cost of a bath and taps is £600, shower and tray £500, sink and taps £200. Ths cost of the plumbing materials to fit the bathroom ware, which we supplied is practically the same.

 

[theskiingbear]

I dont know if everything on the receipts has been used in our bathroom and I cant check and it is almost the cost of the sanitary ware which we supplied. The labour is in addition.

 

[dontknowitall]

If you post a list of what the receipts have then perhaps we could share some more light.

I usually estimate for around £300 for materials for a bathroom (pipe, traps, silicone, etc). It's surprising how it adds up and I think you're correct to query £1,200. That sounds rather steep to me.

 

[moony]

way over priced on materials if youve bought the suite and appliances imo.

i would be asking questions too.

for most bathrooms i allow 150 parts, 50 to board the floor
soil stacks about 120-150 depending on how many tees etc.
valves for towel rail 20


any tiling done as that can make a difference with reagrds to grout adhesive and edging.
and thats with a mark up for using my trade account.

 

[royston]

It does sound like they are making a tasty profit on materials, a small mark up yeah but i think they might be pushing it. Did you not ask for a rough cost before they started, i always like to give a rough estimate on materials but its impossible to be spot on, especially on a biggish job like yours.

 

[theskiingbear]

I have not included the flooring materials as I belive these are Ok, but the plumbing list is as follows :

40mm swept tee white x 3
50mm waste pipe solvent welded x1
50 x 40mm reducer white x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 6
40mm st copupling white x 2
32mm 90 deg universal bend x 1
32mm knuckle bend white x 5
black swan solvent cement x 2
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x1
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
pack 2 hacksaw blades x1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
15 x 1/2" E/Feed back plate elbow x 1
STW3 11/2" shower tray waste x 1
Freeze starter kit x 1
40mm 45 deg bend white x 4
15 x 1/2" x 500 s/fit isolating tap x 2
Horizontal pan/bidet fixing x 1
straight pan connector x 1
hansil contract clear sealant x 2
diamond drill box set x 1
internal flush pipe cone x 1
15mm copper tube per mt tbl x 30
22mm e/feed f x equal elbow x 6
22 x 15mme/feed fitting reducer x 6
32 x 21.5mm waste reducer x 1
isolating valve 15mm cp x 10
15mm x 3 metre chrome tube x 1
32mm swept tee white x 1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
40mm swept tee black x 1
15mm comp equal elbow x 6
15mm e/feed x f equal elbow x 25
15mm e/feed equal tee x 25
isolating valve 15mm cp/h duty x 10
40 straight pan connector x 1
soil double socket grey x 4" x 2
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
40mm swept tee white x 2
32mm 45 deg bend white x 6
32mm knuckle bend x 4
32mm 90 degree universal bend x 2
32mm st coupling x 3
chrome 15mm comp elbow x 2
celafelt pipe insulation 15/22mm 24 FT x 3
Fernox solder 500g x 2
40mm acceess plug x 1
40mm swept tee x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 4
40mm 45 deg knucke bend x 4
40mm st coupling white x 4
soil socket pipe grey 3MT x 4" x 1
soil equal single branch grey 4" x 1
soil strap boss 4" x 1
soil 40mm solvent adaptor x 1
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
32mm access plu x 1
soil 92.5 single socket bend 4 grey x 1

 

[theskiingbear]

Thanks for that, the tiling costs are seperate to this! I have posted a list, I think we are being utterly ripped, your opinion would be welcomed

 

[theskiingbear]

The invoices are from the plumbng supplier, which i presume means without a mark up?

 

[dontknowitall]

I have not included the flooring materials as I belive these are Ok, but the plumbing list is as follows :

40mm swept tee white x 3
50mm waste pipe solvent welded x1
50 x 40mm reducer white x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 6
40mm st copupling white x 2
32mm 90 deg universal bend x 1
32mm knuckle bend white x 5
black swan solvent cement x 2
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x1
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
pack 2 hacksaw blades x1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
15 x 1/2" E/Feed back plate elbow x 1
STW3 11/2" shower tray waste x 1
Freeze starter kit x 1
40mm 45 deg bend white x 4
15 x 1/2" x 500 s/fit isolating tap x 2
Horizontal pan/bidet fixing x 1
straight pan connector x 1
hansil contract clear sealant x 2
diamond drill box set x 1
internal flush pipe cone x 1
15mm copper tube per mt tbl x 30
22mm e/feed f x equal elbow x 6
22 x 15mme/feed fitting reducer x 6
32 x 21.5mm waste reducer x 1
isolating valve 15mm cp x 10
15mm x 3 metre chrome tube x 1
32mm swept tee white x 1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
40mm swept tee black x 1
15mm comp equal elbow x 6
15mm e/feed x f equal elbow x 25
15mm e/feed equal tee x 25
isolating valve 15mm cp/h duty x 10
40 straight pan connector x 1
soil double socket grey x 4" x 2
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
40mm swept tee white x 2
32mm 45 deg bend white x 6
32mm knuckle bend x 4
32mm 90 degree universal bend x 2
32mm st coupling x 3
chrome 15mm comp elbow x 2
celafelt pipe insulation 15/22mm 24 FT x 3
Fernox solder 500g x 2
40mm acceess plug x 1
40mm swept tee x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 4
40mm 45 deg knucke bend x 4
40mm st coupling white x 4
soil socket pipe grey 3MT x 4" x 1
soil equal single branch grey 4" x 1
soil strap boss 4" x 1
soil 40mm solvent adaptor x 1
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
32mm access plu x 1
soil 92.5 single socket bend 4 grey x 1

Blimey! Where do we start?

Can't understand why THREE 40mm tees are required.
Also too many 32mm knuckle bends. This pipe takes your waste from the basin. Usually only 1 or 2 are needed.
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x1
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
This is a con. One pot lasts for months and does all sizes of pipe.
Pack of hacksaw blades. Did you have to pay for screwdrivers, solder, a toolbox and a van?
15 x 1/2" E/Feed back plate elbow x 1 – have you an outside tap fitted in the bathroom? Sounds like this is for another job.
Just found more of those swept tees? Is this including coffee?
And a black tee now!!

I could go on but think the best thing is to summarise this list then confront the installers.

 

[theskiingbear]

How many bathrooms could be fitted with this list???!
I appreciate without you seeing the job you cant precise what we should pay for but how do we know what we should be paying here? We havent paid any of this yet by the way. Just 11 man days labour. Cheers

 

[moony]

diamond drilling set???????????????

 

[theskiingbear]

Its Ok we'll be charging for the use of electricity, greedy, greedy bast*rd 😉

 

[Resolute]

Ignore my earlier post as I assumed the £1200 included the bath suite etc!

How much did they initially quote or estimate?

 

[moony]

I have not included the flooring materials as I belive these are Ok, but the plumbing list is as follows :

40mm swept tee white x 3
50mm waste pipe solvent welded x1
50 x 40mm reducer white x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 6
40mm st copupling white x 2
32mm 90 deg universal bend x 1
32mm knuckle bend white x 5
black swan solvent cement x 2
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x1
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
pack 2 hacksaw blades x1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
15 x 1/2" E/Feed back plate elbow x 1
STW3 11/2" shower tray waste x 1
Freeze starter kit x 1
40mm 45 deg bend white x 4
15 x 1/2" x 500 s/fit isolating tap x 2
Horizontal pan/bidet fixing x 1
straight pan connector x 1
hansil contract clear sealant x 2
diamond drill box set x 1
internal flush pipe cone x 1
15mm copper tube per mt tbl x 30
22mm e/feed f x equal elbow x 6
22 x 15mme/feed fitting reducer x 6
32 x 21.5mm waste reducer x 1
isolating valve 15mm cp x 10
15mm x 3 metre chrome tube x 1
32mm swept tee white x 1
40 x 32mm reducer white x 1
40mm swept tee black x 1
15mm comp equal elbow x 6
15mm e/feed x f equal elbow x 25
15mm e/feed equal tee x 25
isolating valve 15mm cp/h duty x 10
40 straight pan connector x 1
soil double socket grey x 4" x 2
32mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
40mm swept tee white x 2
32mm 45 deg bend white x 6
32mm knuckle bend x 4
32mm 90 degree universal bend x 2
32mm st coupling x 3
chrome 15mm comp elbow x 2
celafelt pipe insulation 15/22mm 24 FT x 3
Fernox solder 500g x 2 is he having a laugh?
40mm acceess plug x 1
40mm swept tee x 1
40mm knuckle bend x 4
40mm 45 deg knucke bend x 4
40mm st coupling white x 4
soil socket pipe grey 3MT x 4" x 1
soil equal single branch grey 4" x 1
soil strap boss 4" x 1
soil 40mm solvent adaptor x 1
40mm waste pipe solvent weld x 1
32mm access plu x 1
soil 92.5 single socket bend 4 grey x 1

without seeing the job i cant comment on the ones in black but i would very much doubt he needed half of all that.

the ones in red - hes taking the pee.

2 tubs of fernox 500grm flux? will last him 6 months lol

yes you have definately had him taking the mick a bit there...

but before i go any further - who aske who to go on day rate? cos what hes done is stock his van up imo but its what a lot of people do when asked to go on day rate and charge for materials.

i would much prefer a customer to ask me for a full quote and then i would get the materials i needed and what i wanted to do for job - when asking lads to go on day rate you do get this sort of behaviour! i get it with sparks that work for me 100m of cable in a bathroom lol.

 

[theskiingbear]

They didnt. we had to go a day rate as we had a plumber in before who botched the job. We couldnt get anyone else to take it on any other way. You should know as well that the plumbing was already in but dodgy, so was "redone" or so we were told.....

 

[PlumbBobBob]

10 cp iso valves, 25 15mm tees, 25 15mm elbows , 2 rolls of solder. taking the p**s a bit

 

[theskiingbear]

"who aske who to go on day rate? cos what hes done is stock his van up imo but its what a lot of people do when asked to go on day rate and charge for materials"

They asked to go on a day rate. See my last post.

 

[moony]

oh and diamond core set? he could perhaps charge you for hiring one - but to buy him one ? if you pay for it tell him you want the set now hes finished with it!

 

[thomas donovan]

maybe he went to perkins and it all adds up

 

[moony]

maybe your conversation should go a bit like this

theskiingbear "can you just go through your materials as i think youve got them mixed up with other materials"
plumber "what?"
theskiingbear "well its just that ive gone through them and a lot of the stuff is excessive and i think youve give me a list of materials with a lot of other stuff on by accident, do you want me to point somethings out"
plumber "yes ok then"
theskiingbear then goes through what we've said is excessive. without dropping us in it haha.

im sure he will put it down as a mistake after trying it on with you and you should save a few hundred quid without it turning into a row ?