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Elbow
Re: Magic Heating Box
One of the firms selling this gadget is Green Home Energy Ltd - Director Thomas Callaghan, who apparently has previous:
"Once upon a time, Lee Comer was a plumber. But he has come a long way since those days. He is now a company director and lives in a beautiful thatched cottage in Dorset complete with its own stables.
How did he make his money? Answer: out of pensioners like Wendy Hammett.
Mrs Hammett, 66, a former secretary, paid Comer's firm, Simplee Solar, more than £10,000 for solar panels at her bungalow outside Bournemouth.
Controversy: Lee Comer (standing) and Tom Callaghan of Simplee Solar were fined a total of £40,000 (with £27,000 costs) at Bournemouth Crown Court for supplying and offering goods to which a false trade description applied
The system, she was promised, would slash her gas and electric bills by 70 per cent. It was a lie.
'It has ended up costing me more,' she said. She is not alone. Other elderly customers of Simplee Solar suffered a similar fate.
In 2006, Comer and his partner Tom Callaghan were fined a total of £40,000 (with £27,000 costs) at Bournemouth Crown Court for supplying and offering goods to which a false trade description applied. That's the legal term for cowboy tactics.
One of the firms selling this gadget is Green Home Energy Ltd - Director Thomas Callaghan, who apparently has previous:
"Once upon a time, Lee Comer was a plumber. But he has come a long way since those days. He is now a company director and lives in a beautiful thatched cottage in Dorset complete with its own stables.
How did he make his money? Answer: out of pensioners like Wendy Hammett.
Mrs Hammett, 66, a former secretary, paid Comer's firm, Simplee Solar, more than £10,000 for solar panels at her bungalow outside Bournemouth.
The system, she was promised, would slash her gas and electric bills by 70 per cent. It was a lie.
'It has ended up costing me more,' she said. She is not alone. Other elderly customers of Simplee Solar suffered a similar fate.
In 2006, Comer and his partner Tom Callaghan were fined a total of £40,000 (with £27,000 costs) at Bournemouth Crown Court for supplying and offering goods to which a false trade description applied. That's the legal term for cowboy tactics.
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Centralheatking
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
It's most probably full of platinum at that price.
It's most probably full of platinum at that price.
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Ray Stafford
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
I am always suspicious of any "magic" product, particularly when the sales channel is direct to the householder.
If their technology stood up to expert inspection, why not sell it through conventional channels?
A few months ago there was someone posting on the forum with some new "magic" energy saving product (not this one). I spoke to them on the phone, and it was clear that the sales director didn't even understand schoolboy physics. Then their "technical director" phoned me, and could not answer basic arithmetical questions about his published efficiency calculations, and had never heard of "SEDBUK" ratings. I struggled to believe such poorly substantiated claims.
Just in case someone reads this thread because they are considering buying a "magic solution" product of any sort, please take this advice from someone who has been selling heating equipment for nearly three decades.
There are no magic solutions. The best way to save energy is to have a well designed system, with appropriate controls (take the trouble to find out how they work!) fitted by a competent installer in a well insulated property. The optimum system design will depend on your property, lifestyle and budget - this can't be determined over the phone, or via the internet.
I am always suspicious of any "magic" product, particularly when the sales channel is direct to the householder.
If their technology stood up to expert inspection, why not sell it through conventional channels?
A few months ago there was someone posting on the forum with some new "magic" energy saving product (not this one). I spoke to them on the phone, and it was clear that the sales director didn't even understand schoolboy physics. Then their "technical director" phoned me, and could not answer basic arithmetical questions about his published efficiency calculations, and had never heard of "SEDBUK" ratings. I struggled to believe such poorly substantiated claims.
Just in case someone reads this thread because they are considering buying a "magic solution" product of any sort, please take this advice from someone who has been selling heating equipment for nearly three decades.
There are no magic solutions. The best way to save energy is to have a well designed system, with appropriate controls (take the trouble to find out how they work!) fitted by a competent installer in a well insulated property. The optimum system design will depend on your property, lifestyle and budget - this can't be determined over the phone, or via the internet.
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Elbow
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Here's a photo of a "Magic Heating Box" installed. (Are you supposed to have a balanced flue installed right under an airbrick?)
[DLMURL="http://www.supersealltd.co.uk/blog/2013/04/mr-and-mrs-brown-install-new-revolutionary-magic-heating-box/"][FONT=&][/FONT][/DLMURL][DLMURL]http://www.supersealltd.co.uk/blog/2013/04/mr-and-mrs-brown-install-new-revolutionary-magic-heating-box/[/DLMURL]
Here's a photo of a "Magic Heating Box" installed. (Are you supposed to have a balanced flue installed right under an airbrick?)
[DLMURL="http://www.supersealltd.co.uk/blog/2013/04/mr-and-mrs-brown-install-new-revolutionary-magic-heating-box/"][FONT=&][/FONT][/DLMURL][DLMURL]http://www.supersealltd.co.uk/blog/2013/04/mr-and-mrs-brown-install-new-revolutionary-magic-heating-box/[/DLMURL]
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Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
The is just speil and that pump is a no no in my opinion.
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Rickster123
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
If that pic is one of the better installs I'd be very worried!
If that pic is one of the better installs I'd be very worried!
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erpkid
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Definitely. Reading the article is the customer not just experiencing the benefits of a flushed system with new radiator valves?
Definitely. Reading the article is the customer not just experiencing the benefits of a flushed system with new radiator valves?
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Centralheatking
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Dont forget the AAV @ £1.00 each ! There is an important lesson here - which is as Ray pointed out there are no magic solutions and just cause something is patented does not mean it is suitable or economical.
centralheatking
Dont forget the AAV @ £1.00 each ! There is an important lesson here - which is as Ray pointed out there are no magic solutions and just cause something is patented does not mean it is suitable or economical.
centralheatking
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simon0703
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
I personally would of changed the boiler for A new one. I keep watching more videos on this.
I personally would of changed the boiler for A new one. I keep watching more videos on this.
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tom bishop
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Hi everybody,
I'm new in this forum. I'm an italian engineer who have met today Tim Cremlin presenting his "Magic Heating Box" in Italy. After two hours with him I've understood just a think. It can not work. It's just a low loss header design to mix the temperatures of the boiler and send water to the radiators at lower temperature. He told me about 30% of savings, but I think it can not be true. Just a piece of nonsense for me. In Italy we are use to increase efficiency of about 30% of our gas plants installing condensing boilers plus thermostatic valves on the radiators at the same price (about 3000€) and the results are insured.
He told me he have already installed 2000 box in UK, can anyone confirm this? Who can pay 3000€ for an iron box with a low loss header inside? Are you kidding me?
Anyway I just lost 2 hours of my time.
Hi everybody,
I'm new in this forum. I'm an italian engineer who have met today Tim Cremlin presenting his "Magic Heating Box" in Italy. After two hours with him I've understood just a think. It can not work. It's just a low loss header design to mix the temperatures of the boiler and send water to the radiators at lower temperature. He told me about 30% of savings, but I think it can not be true. Just a piece of nonsense for me. In Italy we are use to increase efficiency of about 30% of our gas plants installing condensing boilers plus thermostatic valves on the radiators at the same price (about 3000€) and the results are insured.
He told me he have already installed 2000 box in UK, can anyone confirm this? Who can pay 3000€ for an iron box with a low loss header inside? Are you kidding me?
Anyway I just lost 2 hours of my time.
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Elbow
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Hi Tom. Welcome to the forum. The Magic Box website says they already have a distributor in Italy - in Cremona - is that anywhere near you?
Magic Thermodynamic Box, Thermodynamic and hot water system, boiler, solar power heater
€3,000 you say? That's a lot cheaper than what is being charged in the UK - we've heard £8,000 or even £13,000. Or is that the price Tim Cremlin is asking from distributors?
Hi Tom. Welcome to the forum. The Magic Box website says they already have a distributor in Italy - in Cremona - is that anywhere near you?
Magic Thermodynamic Box, Thermodynamic and hot water system, boiler, solar power heater
€3,000 you say? That's a lot cheaper than what is being charged in the UK - we've heard £8,000 or even £13,000. Or is that the price Tim Cremlin is asking from distributors?
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tom bishop
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Yes, I'm from near Cremona and was exactly the distributor that called me to check the system and understand if it's a scam. The cost of about 3000€ is just for the box without the set-up of the plant.
Yes, I'm from near Cremona and was exactly the distributor that called me to check the system and understand if it's a scam. The cost of about 3000€ is just for the box without the set-up of the plant.
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Elbow
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Sorry, I don't quite understand you. Are you saying that Universal Connections from Cremona asked you to attend a presentation by Tim Cremlin, and give your opinion?
Sorry, I don't quite understand you. Are you saying that Universal Connections from Cremona asked you to attend a presentation by Tim Cremlin, and give your opinion?
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tom bishop
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Yes, I attended a presentation by Tim Cremin and Universal Connections asked me my opinion
Yes, I attended a presentation by Tim Cremin and Universal Connections asked me my opinion
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Joshua Parker
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Hi guys I actually a attended one of theseseminars at Chelmsford to look at the heating management system and to behonest was very skeptical, after the presentation It made sense but I couldn'tget my head round it as it in theory defies the laws of plumbing as we know it.I asked if I could see an installation and if there was any work as I wouldlike to complete some installs myself. They were very helpful and I was out onan install for site training the very next day, as crazy as it may seem the systemwas fantastic, the complete radiator heated up within 20 mins on a 16 radsystem, the delta T was reduced to 3 degrees which I did not think waspossible. consequently I have know installed 10 of these systems which I canassure you have all improved the customers heating, I actually went back to twoof the customers to see how the system was performing as they were local andthey have noticed a significant change with theincrease speed with the property heating up performance of the all radiators (all being the same temperature) and the boiler running for less time thannormal. One of the two customer has actually turned there room stat down from21 to 19. I really think this is going to take off.
Hi guys I actually a attended one of theseseminars at Chelmsford to look at the heating management system and to behonest was very skeptical, after the presentation It made sense but I couldn'tget my head round it as it in theory defies the laws of plumbing as we know it.I asked if I could see an installation and if there was any work as I wouldlike to complete some installs myself. They were very helpful and I was out onan install for site training the very next day, as crazy as it may seem the systemwas fantastic, the complete radiator heated up within 20 mins on a 16 radsystem, the delta T was reduced to 3 degrees which I did not think waspossible. consequently I have know installed 10 of these systems which I canassure you have all improved the customers heating, I actually went back to twoof the customers to see how the system was performing as they were local andthey have noticed a significant change with theincrease speed with the property heating up performance of the all radiators (all being the same temperature) and the boiler running for less time thannormal. One of the two customer has actually turned there room stat down from21 to 19. I really think this is going to take off.
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Ray Stafford
Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Hi Joshua
Forgive me for being cynical, but can you prove that you are a bona-fide heating engineer, and not just an internet shill? For example, can you give your Gassafe registration number, or a link to your website?
Its not the laws of plumbing that concern me, its the laws of physics. I don't mind contradicting a plumber (do it all the time!) but when it comes to contradicting Isaac Newton, I come over all shy.
Hi Joshua
Forgive me for being cynical, but can you prove that you are a bona-fide heating engineer, and not just an internet shill? For example, can you give your Gassafe registration number, or a link to your website?
Its not the laws of plumbing that concern me, its the laws of physics. I don't mind contradicting a plumber (do it all the time!) but when it comes to contradicting Isaac Newton, I come over all shy.
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Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box
Watch the oil installation video, its a low loss header with a pump for the boiler to low loss header and then individual room/cylinder stats linked to each zones zone zalve and its own pump, totally useless if you only have CH and HW zones. The heat up times could only be measured against a system with an undersized pump. As for the radiators its obvious thats just the power flush.
The programmer is well.....just a programmer!
Saving money? How by running three pumps instead of one....
Watch the oil installation video, its a low loss header with a pump for the boiler to low loss header and then individual room/cylinder stats linked to each zones zone zalve and its own pump, totally useless if you only have CH and HW zones. The heat up times could only be measured against a system with an undersized pump. As for the radiators its obvious thats just the power flush.
The programmer is well.....just a programmer!
Saving money? How by running three pumps instead of one....
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