DIY Project To Zone My House

[Richard at Home]

Good evening and a happy new year to you all

I welcome any comments and feedback to my project I am looking at starting in 2013

now I know all this sort of thing can be done with many of the costly out of the box solutions that probably cost more than the boiler itself

What I am looking at doing is to create a heating system that has at least 3 Zones

I believe I could do this with some changes to the main Pipe work and 3 motorised zone valves and an additional time clock


Reason for project

During the day one member of my family is at home and requires heating to be on for 4 rads in part of the house.

Currently I am heating all the house all day when only part of the house needs to be heated

My daughter-in-law is also at home some times when not at Uni and may need her front room heating.

Now my logic is to have the secondary time clock switching the water flow between parts of the house during the day and in the evenings opening all valves to heat the complete house

Now I know this could also be done with the new wireless digital TVRs but this expense would be significant


I will add to this post as the project develops

If you have any questions or would like to bounce ideas or comments please reply and this may become an interesting post.


Thank you for your time

Best regards

Richard

 

[Richard at Home]

To be honest i can use powerpoint but this was in excel

 

[TBServices]

I would never ask someone to take on this sort of project on Professional or otherwise for me.

It is something i want to do as a project.

I moved in the house 3 years ago and the old plumbing is a mess and i want to remove it all and reinstall a new clean layout.

I will 100% guarantee that I will do this. it will work how i intend it to, and i will share all my experiences with you all good and bad and hopefully some may enjoy the read.


Thanks

Richard

In that case, starting from fresh, don't make the same mistakes again. Use the right tools and materials for the job. And while you're at it, take out the y plan valve on your cylinder and fit 4 2 port valves.

 

[TBServices]

Into IT for work you mean

No not at work i work in engineering

What a shocker lol. Sick of hearing this.

No offence OP.

 

[Howsie]

I have drawn up the current layout of the Heating and Hot water system and i am going to use this as my basis for my modification for the project
I have not drawn up the proposed layout yet

But my idea is to take the 2 main 22mm flow and return pipes and add 2 more runs making a total of 3 Main Zones
Connect the desired Radiators to them and join them all up with the Zone valves to create one system full system.
Hope that makes sense

Can't really read the detail on my phone. Why not junk the pumps and the CWST and install an unvented tank?

 

[Richard at Home]

if you are talking about a Combi system the mains water pressure on my property is very poor and insufficient for the size

I am running a valiant 438 eco tec System boiler

 

[SimonG]

I will 100% guarantee that I will do this. it will work how i intend it to

Sorry Richard but that's a recipe for disaster, it's entirely the wrong attitude. Everybody has limitations, it's knowing them that's the key and keeping you out of trouble.

Good luck, I'm out.

 

[jase158]

I know nothing of zone valves but just had a think about it and I would get the pack for my first time and some advice from plumbers I know to get me going (best advice IMHO)

However it sound like you are going to do it your way anyay and ignore the best advice so stick 3 x 2 port valves in, get 2 time switches (one zone would be on your hot water button) and go on electrician forum and find out how to wire it all in.
only thing I would be worried about is the wiring to the boiler and pump as you dont want to send too much power to the Boiler and blow the fuse/circuit board every 2 seconds.

best case = everything works well, no garuntee though so will have to change components at own cost
worse case = new circuit board, everything ripped out and done again so twice the cost.

What I would be interested in is, would it make any difference costwise. if your boiler is working all day heating 4 rooms, How much money will you actually save rather then heating the whole house?

 

[jase158]

oh and the cost of zone valve kit vs your homemade diy project!!

 

[MrMeek]

All I have to say is Im going to spend the night on excel to make layouts like that :O

 

[TBServices]

You'll need 4 2 port valves, a 4 channel programmer or 2x2 programmers, and you'll also need a new room stat in each zone. You'll have to replace valves in room stat locations.

Tip, if you're an engineer, you should be able to afford a professional. This will only end in tears and as already said, you have the wrong attitude. It's also the wrong time of year to be leaving your family without heat and HW for a prolonged period, which it will be, it will take you a very very very long time to complete this "project". I'd advise you focused your extra energy on something else, like a classic car or bike lol

 

[Richard at Home]

Well there are 19 radiators so heating 4 not 19 is a significant load in my mind

I think there is a little misunderstanding about how i am planning to control the zone valves

This will just be a Power to a separate time clock ( Not connected to the boiler in any way )

This time clock will just turn the zone valves on and off throughout the day regardless of the running of the boiler

The boiler is always on and comes on via the stat and if the room stat drops the boiler fires up

as an example If it was in the morning the boiler would only be pushing water around the 4 rads ( Controlled separately by the other time clock that will only control the zone valves )

If the boiler comes on a 5 in the evening all the zone valves would be open and all 19 rads would be heated


The hot water would just work in the same way

The boiler will be heating the hot water through the STD Valiant time clock or it would be heating rads through the STD Vailant time clock

if the vailant time clock its on heating the only difference is that the stand alown time clock will change how many rads the boiler it heating

This is just my idea of how it will work

I hope i have explained it

Thanks Richard

Please don’t think i am ignoring any advise that is passed on. this is not the case, i will do the project because i believe i can make it work as i want it to and will save me money for heating.

If not I will put it back to its current state

PS i only started the idea last week and have drawn up the current system to work with.

Thanks

Richard

 

[AlexGas]

I have drawn up the current layout of the Heating and Hot water system and i am going to use this as my basis for my modification for the project

You got your vent pipe WRONG!!!

 

[TBServices]

You CLEARLY have no clue how these things work (see your previous post). To continue beyond this point would be idiotic.

 

[Howsie]

Well you're not really zoning the system, more shutting parts down based on a time only basis.

It'll work the way you've outlined it above but it's not right.

What's your household insurance policy like?

 

[AlexGas]

It's a FAIL!

 

[TBServices]

It won't work. I'm not telling you why, but it won't work.

 

[Howsie]

He's not altering the vent pipe though.

 

[Richard at Home]

Thanks for your feedback

I am not going to pull it apart just yet and i will install all the new pipe work prior to disconnecting the current layout

I do think a lot of people do not follow how i am going to set this up though

please read my last post.

I do not want to use extra room stats and boiler feedback etc

my new system will just either heat the 4 rads or 8 rads or all 19 depending on the zone valves that are controlled totally separately by a stand alone time clock

all my zone valves will do is change the size of the heating circuit that is available to the current heating system setup.

Thanks

Richard

 

[TBServices]

Thanks for your feedback

I am not going to pull it apart just yet and i will install all the new pipe work prior to disconnecting the current layout

I do think a lot of people do not follow how i am going to set this up though

please read my last post.

I do not want to use extra room stats and boiler feedback etc

my new system will just either heat the 4 rads or 8 rads or all 19 depending on the zone valves that are controlled totally separately by a stand alone time clock

all my zone valves will do is change the size of the heating circuit that is available to the current heating system setup.

Thanks

Richard

No one here has trouble comprehending your "plan". Rather its you who can't understand why it's WRONG.

 

[Richard at Home]

May i ask what is incorrect with the vent pipe as it works fine.

 

[Richard at Home]

The only significant issue I am aware of is the power rating of the boiler in relation to the number of rads i am heating may cause me to trigger pump overrun error due to the speed the water heats up.

I am sure there are other issues i will encounter.

Thanks

Richard

 

[Dotty]

The only significant issue I am aware of is the power rating of the boiler in relation to the number of rads i am heating may cause me to trigger pump overrun error due to the speed the water heats up.

I am sure there are other issues i will encounter.

Thanks

Richard

You can bet on it.

Red Adair's quote springs to mind.

 

[SimonG]

'If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur.' Red Adair

 

[Richard at Home]

I have seen both in action

At least when a ameture does a bad job you can justify it

When you see a profetional make a mess it is embarrising

 

[AlexGas]

That's not real!

 

[AlexGas]

It's a wind up!!!

 

[Richard at Home]

Off topic a little


Took my 2009 VW Golf DTI 140 into Tamworth Volkswagen on 28/12/2012 for a new cam belt and water pump replacement

Could i have done it myself?

Yes

Do i have the tools or the workshop to do it in

No


Did i have to refit the Cam Belt Cover on the car after i received the car back

Yes !

I presumed this was a professional at work. Maybe Not !

 

[lame plumber]

Off topic a little


Took my 2009 VW Golf DTI 140 into Tamworth Volkswagen on 28/12/2012 for a new cam belt and water pump replacement

Could i have done it myself?

Yes

Do i have the tools or the workshop to do it in

No


Did i have to refit the Cam Belt Cover on the car after i received the car back

Yes !

I presumed this was a professional at work. Maybe Not !

I expect they didnt want to be at work on the 28-12-12, I didnt either,

 

[Richard at Home]

what is not real ?

 

[TBServices]

The moral of that story is not to do it yourself, but to use a trusted professional. VW could have used any one of their numerous engineers and apprentices to do that job. Should have gone to an independant vw mechanic, there's plenty around and it's easy to find a recommended fitter, with a bit of research.

 

[Richard at Home]

Oh so the quality you receive from a professional or a DIY person totally depends on the date ....

Sorry my mistake

I am sure the price was the same

I am looking forward to seeing VW reply on the subject when they reply

 

[Richard at Home]

Ok my mistake again ...

 

[Richard at Home]

Well thank you all for your time i have enjoyed the topic
This project is not a wind up !

In fear of upsetting anyone, which by the way was never my intention it was just to share my project

I will update the post again and let you know how i am getting on

If what i do is crap and does not work i will be totally honest and advise my experience accordingly

Whatever happens i will 100% guarantee it will be better then what heating and hot water system that was installed when i moved in

I remember the hot water tank was a horizontal type in the loft about 20 years old ! that was the first thing that went.

Best Regards

Richard

 

[Rickster123]

Best of luck Richard. Please do keep us updated. :mickey:

 

[Richard at Home]

No problems I will keep you up to date.

Even if i get i told you so comments, I do not mind

Regards

Richard