Gas hob ID or AR

[Compression nut]

Another one with @Aquarius here!
NCS. (still exists).

If this is a NG appliance (not 3rd family gas) it is allowed in a basement with the correct/adequate ventilation.

If it has no FFD built into it (normally due to the time it was manufactured) then it is not to current standards as today's appliances would have that facility. If they were not there due to that then this is not something which must be done/fitted retrospectively.

If the knob/valve is seized, in the closed position and not leaking gas then it is not constituting a danger to life or property.

I understand your views on 7.4 but if a manually operated valve on a cooker is seized off and not leaking, then it is not affecting the safe operation of a gas appliance in my opinion.

This is just the way I view the scenario you described and I thought it might help to hear a different point of view. Obviously it would be safer with FFD's and it is advisable to have the gas tap repaired or replaced but that decision is for the owners/responsible persons after hearing your advice.

Did you ask permission to disconnect the appliance or did you cap it anyway? You/we have no legal right to disconnect a gas appliance without the permission of the owner or responsible person.

Hi

apologies should have made it clear it’s natural gas. Thanks everyone for all your input.

yes I asked permission and it was granted. Forgive me for saying and not picking on anybody here but 7.4 does not make any distinction if it’s leaking gas or not. Other unsafe procedures do. It simply states gas control and safety devices inoperative = ID

i have had 2 technical advisors, 1 advised me NCS And yes I’m aware that does not apply anymore on cp12 but of course new gas appliances have to be fitted to standard.

the other technical advisor 24 hours earlier advised my colleague that it’s AR.

ok let’s just saythe technical advisors one of them Or both of them may have made a mistake. No big‘ee because as rgi it’s our decision and we are ultimately responsible and will be the first ones that have explain our actions if something goes wrong. Forget about recorded telephone conversations with technical advisors these can’t be relied on.

I don’t want have to tell a tenant the following regarding this hob

look mate the control nob on your cooker is broken, it’s about 20 years old. What you can do is pull off a working nob and change it round the broken one.

Just be careful that it doesn’t leak gas, your not an rgi so you haven’t got the equipment to confirm this so just use your nose. Remember though that you’ve turned on the other hob ring using the borrowed control nob so that might be the cause of the smell of gas. Once you’ve got the hob ring lit that you wanted, if the other hob ring comes alight that you didn’t want . pull off the control nob stick back on the one and turn off the gas.

now don’t drop the control nob whatever you do, it’s a big basement flat and the gas in air rate is 5 to 15% to go kappow so you will have plenty of time. You can turn off the gas at the meter but that may annoy the landlord as his gas hob hasn’t got this problem and he might be cooking his tea. Or use a phillips screwdriver, unscrew 2screws and lift out the electric cooker, careful don’t drop it on your foot. And theirs an isolation valve.

don’t look so worried pal, im ignoring unsafe procedures 7.4 cos I phoned up gas safe, they record all the telephone conversations and they told me its perfectly acceptable. Anyway its not their fault as they don’t make the rules. I’m going to leave you now as I’m putting all my faith inthat telephone chat and if something goes wrong I’m covered.

joking aside lads
thanks for all your reply’s, I think this threads exhausted now but I will always encourage a landlord to cut and cap, if this comes up again in the next 25 years iwould definitely ar regardless

 

[Ric2013]

Actually that last post has now changed the state of play regarding the seized control knob and I think it makes a material difference.

Previously I had the impression that one gas tap was seized and it was unable to be turned on. Personally, as a non-RGI, I agree this is at least AR as potentially someone manages to free it and turn it on and then it potentially sticks open.

Now I have the impression that all the gas taps work, but one has a knob missing. While I agree absolutely that the last thing you want is the end user making a habit of swapping control knobs about, I think the situation is rather different.

 

[Compression nut]

Actually that last post has now changed the state of play regarding the seized control knob and I think it makes a material difference.

Previously I had the impression that one gas tap was seized and it was unable to be turned on. Personally, as a non-RGI, I agree this is at least AR as potentially someone manages to free it and turn it on and then it potentially sticks open.

Now I have the impression that all the gas taps work, but one has a knob missing. While I agree absolutely that the last thing you want is the end user making a habit of swapping control knobs about, I think the situation is rather different.

Sorry my bad not making it clear.

This gas Hob has 4 burners, and all 4 control nobs are present. One control nob i was unable to turn. Very old hob as no ffd (which is just extra info and is acceptable for age of hob)

I’m their to do a cp12 only nothing else. I am very careful not to turn it to hard as it’s old and the plastic nob may break, happened to me before. So most probably you could strip down the gas cock and give it some molly to grease it up, careful not to block ports. Everything else is is fine with the rest of the installation.

 

[Aquarius]

I’m their to do a cp12 only nothing else.

CP12 aka lgsr/lgsc - surely if unable to turn, still only notifiable?

 

[Compression nut]

CP12 aka lgsr/lgsc - surely if unable to turn, still only notifiable?

Hi mate

sorry mate my interpretation of 7.4 is if gas control is inoperative = ID. My train of thought is the nob is unable to turn the gas cock inside the hob, I’m classing the gas cock as a gas control. As the gas cock is seized up I’m classing that as inoperative So I ID the gas hob.

Gas safe don’t agree with me and most rgi on here don’t. I’m getting mixed messages from the technical helpline.

im happy with my decision. I hope this scenario underlines the importance of making your own decisions as rgi as you are responsible and will have to give a good account of your thoughts processes and decision making process and why you decided to make safe or not as is the case.

if something awful happened you may be involved in an investigation. Saying I was told this by the technical helpline that’s it’s ok and relying on a recorded conversation may not help you. You are the person with the training, qualifications, insurance and made that decision that you will have to explain to a higher authority if it goes wrong.

Again insurance may not cover you if they believe you acted in the wrong and you will have to fund any defence yourself.

I try my best to read the rules, understand and apply them. I have a healthy dose of self preservation and hopefully common sense. If I don’t think that is not the correct course of action, no matter what technical helpline says or a forum. I’m going to err on the side of caution as at the end of the day I fully realise if it all goes wrong the rgi is in the firing line first and foremost

im off for a beer, have a great wknd

 

[Aquarius]

Tbh, ive been there myself mate, many times. Had numerous mixed messages from gas safe technical helpline, and on here. I guess everyone interprets things in their own way.