H2 Panel.

[Ermintrude]

But the economic benefits are low if using solid fuel intermittently and topping off with oil or gas? You have both boilers and a h2 panel and lots of other bits. Expensive way of harvesting a little heat? If stove on house will be hot and ufh stops circulating and then when house cold u use oil to heat. Thermal store stores heat till it's useful?

 

[Gray0689]

But the economic benefits are low if using solid fuel intermittently and topping off with oil or gas? You have both boilers and a h2 panel and lots of other bits. Expensive way of harvesting a little heat? If stove on house will be hot and ufh stops circulating and then when house cold u use oil to heat. Thermal store stores heat till it's useful?

Or just put in a buffer don't need a huge one
A direct cylinder18x36 usually is fine

 

[Ermintrude]

http://heatweb.com/Wood/index.htm

 

[Killy Bing]

Well i want to read up on the design but i was thinking a buffer tank.

i do have a spare 3000 litre thermal store though..........

 

[Gray0689]

Well i want to read up on the design but i was thinking a buffer tank.

i do have a spare 3000 litre thermal store though..........

Lol you will need a bloody big stove then lol

 

[SimonG]

Simon, how did this job go, and what were your conclusions?

Still waiting to complete it. Its been running a while just on the oil boiler. It will probably be the summer before they can afford the stove.

 

[wetdrip]

Still waiting to complete it. Its been running a while just on the oil boiler. It will probably be the summer before they can afford the stove.

Thanks for getting back Simon.Looking forward to hearing your final conclusions.

 

[Pipes Plumbing]

H2 panels are good at what they do, and I have fitted a fair few over the recent years. I am using them less and less now though, as I find I can make a better system for less cost (more profit) by doing it differently...

If the property already has S or Y plan fitted, it works out a lot cheaper to use a low loss header or even one of the neutralisers from Dunsley.
This works well where a stove is to go gravity only too, so long as the llh is sited and piped right... The stove's gravity flow goes to the header with a heat leak in parallel and is then pumped off from there to where it's needed.
My business is 90% solid fuel and biomass, I'd be happy to help with any questions anyone has too but don't get a lot of time to be on here so drop me a PM if I can help...

 

[Dotty]

H2 panels are good at what they do, and I have fitted a fair few over the recent years. I am using them less and less now though, as I find I can make a better system for less cost (more profit) by doing it differently...

If the property already has S or Y plan fitted, it works out a lot cheaper to use a low loss header or even one of the neutralisers from Dunsley.
This works well where a stove is to go gravity only too, so long as the llh is sited and piped right... The stove's gravity flow goes to the header with a heat leak in parallel and is then pumped off from there to where it's needed.
My business is 90% solid fuel and biomass, I'd be happy to help with any questions anyone has too but don't get a lot of time to be on here so drop me a PM if I can help...

Now that's an interesting post!

 

[Gray0689]

H2 panels are good at what they do, and I have fitted a fair few over the recent years. I am using them less and less now though, as I find I can make a better system for less cost (more profit) by doing it differently...

If the property already has S or Y plan fitted, it works out a lot cheaper to use a low loss header or even one of the neutralisers from Dunsley.
This works well where a stove is to go gravity only too, so long as the llh is sited and piped right... The stove's gravity flow goes to the header with a heat leak in parallel and is then pumped off from there to where it's needed.
My business is 90% solid fuel and biomass, I'd be happy to help with any questions anyone has too but don't get a lot of time to be on here so drop me a PM if I can help...

But in an unvented cylinder it's either a h2 panel or a buffer as far as I'm made aware
I've fitted a few with buffer but never h2 but I'd deffo like to try it at some point

The way you do it is a pretty standard practice over here

 

[Pipes Plumbing]

But in an unvented cylinder it's either a h2 panel or a buffer as far as I'm made aware
I've fitted a few with buffer but never h2 but I'd deffo like to try it at some point

The way you do it is a pretty standard practice over here

You can do unvented cylinders off a stove without an H2 or buffer, so long as you make sure that you can maintain 3 tiers of safety control to prevent boiling.
The easiest way is to have a NC 2 port in the flow to the cylinder wired to the cylinder stat and cut-out stat to close when satisfied, along with the TPRV & PRV on the cylinder you will satisfy regs. A high limit stat on the flow to bring the heating / additional heat dumps will help matters.
You will need to consider how to dump the heat produced once the cylinder's closed, as the heat load on the system will dip, so you'll need to have a high limit stat on the solid fuel pipework to kick the heating into life when the flow temp gets to 75 - 80 from the stove. Heat leaks will need to be sized carefully too, in order to make sure that they can cope.
In some cases you can put additional gravity heat leaks in, where a large boiler stove on apumped system may go down in a power / pump failure. We have done a couple of these where we have put a heat dump array into the loft of a property with a N.O 2 port inline, which will spring open in the event of power failure or an overheat stat breaks.

The H2 panel is simply a few valves and stats wired in interlock, which doesn't give any more control than you can get on your own, it just makes it a lot easier to put it all together on a smallish system.
To be honest you can do a lot of things in real life that many people say are a no go such as linking a stove into a pressurised system or Linking into a Combi Boiler... It all just takes a bit of planning and the right kit 🙂

*Edit*
A buffer / accumulator tank is a great addition to a solid fuel system, so you can smooth out the heat delivered from the stove boiler
Thermal stores work brilliantly too with solid fuel, they make it much easier to live with as there is heat available when the stoves not roaring away.

 

[Gray0689]

Building control won't let you put a stove into an unvented cylinder in our area unless it's on a buffer
H2 would be allowed as it is recognised by building control
Anything else on unvented will not pass in our area of Northern Ireland

 

[Pipes Plumbing]

Ah, fair enough that's always interesting to know 🙂 Makes it a bit of a pain to work around then I guess...

 

[Gray0689]

Ah, fair enough that's always interesting to know 🙂 Makes it a bit of a pain to work around then I guess...

You said it mate

 

[Bunker]

I wish I had an idea what you are all talking about

 

[oz-plumber]

I wish I had an idea what you are all talking about 

So do I....Y Plans, S Plans, W Plans, S Plan modified, Y plan modified.
and so on....

The only plan i'm concentrating on is my retirement plan.....I should be able to achieve that when I am @ 128 years old

 

[wetdrip]

You can do unvented cylinders off a stove without an H2 or buffer, so long as you make sure that you can maintain 3 tiers of safety control to prevent boiling.
The easiest way is to have a NC 2 port in the flow to the cylinder wired to the cylinder stat and cut-out stat to close when satisfied, along with the TPRV & PRV on the cylinder you will satisfy regs. A high limit stat on the flow to bring the heating / additional heat dumps will help matters.
You will need to consider how to dump the heat produced once the cylinder's closed, as the heat load on the system will dip, so you'll need to have a high limit stat on the solid fuel pipework to kick the heating into life when the flow temp gets to 75 - 80 from the stove. Heat leaks will need to be sized carefully too, in order to make sure that they can cope.
In some cases you can put additional gravity heat leaks in, where a large boiler stove on apumped system may go down in a power / pump failure. We have done a couple of these where we have put a heat dump array into the loft of a property with a N.O 2 port inline, which will spring open in the event of power failure or an overheat stat breaks.

The H2 panel is simply a few valves and stats wired in interlock, which doesn't give any more control than you can get on your own, it just makes it a lot easier to put it all together on a smallish system.
To be honest you can do a lot of things in real life that many people say are a no go such as linking a stove into a pressurised system or Linking into a Combi Boiler... It all just takes a bit of planning and the right kit 🙂

*Edit*
A buffer / accumulator tank is a great addition to a solid fuel system, so you can smooth out the heat delivered from the stove boiler
Thermal stores work brilliantly too with solid fuel, they make it much easier to live with as there is heat available when the stoves not roaring away.

Great post. Would love to see a Masterclass thread on this.

 

[Ermintrude]

Recently seek a quenching supply which is controlled by a pocket stat on fire. .

 

[Pipes Plumbing]

The Broseley Evo 26 and some of the aquatherms have these fitted where they are approved for sealed systems...
Its basically a coil in the boiler with an STS20 valve on one end and drain on the other.

Good o see some progress with units approved for sealed systems 🙂

 

[TBServices]

Sure I've asked this before, but if you really wanted to keep the heating system sealed, could you not use a big plate hex or some other means of indirect heat transfer?