Help and Advice on Gas Safe Engineer not registering installation with Gas Safe

[Ermintrude]

A lady i spoke to at the HSE said that the buildings compliance certificate can be used to demonstrate the gas safety of the new appliance. She said that as i had not been issued one I would have to get a gas safety certificate done for the new boiler. If I had the certificate I could wait until my current CP12 expires before having to get a new one. I know i need to get the buildings compliance certificate but from a legal standpoint it is separate to the gas safety directive from the HSE.

HSE are GS . GS is just HSE puppet operated by capita. You could call local building control and explain situation, but think they charge a lot to self cert. I wouldn't register another installers job on my number.

Can't you reason with installer original installer?

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

A lady i spoke to at the HSE said that the buildings compliance certificate can be used to demonstrate the gas safety of the new appliance. She said that as i had not been issued one I would have to get a gas safety certificate done for the new boiler. If I had the certificate I could wait until my current CP12 expires before having to get a new one. I know i need to get the buildings compliance certificate but from a legal standpoint it is separate to the gas safety directive from the HSE.

The HSE lady is wrong - you need evidence the gas boiler was installed by someone legally qualified to do so.
The building regs certificate does do that but it is not the only proof - the invoice by the engineer should suffice?
along with all the paper work he may have filled in.

These Building regs compliance certificates have only been issued for about 8 years or so.

But the Gas Safety Regs for landlords are 1998.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

Finally, after sleeping on your original question for a while I remembered that when the building control certificates came in to force gas engineers were never obliged to be a part of that scheme. The obligation is on the home owner.

It just would make good financial sense for the home owner to find an engineer who could do that for them. And as gas installers it is an easy part of our routine that we just take it forgranted now.
To have a leg to stand on in the small claims court you must have it written in your contract that the engineer would notify building control - otherwise it is down to you and likely to be costly - you could telephone your local building control dept to find out.

 

[Ermintrude]

The HSE lady is wrong - you need evidence the gas boiler was installed by someone legally qualified to do so.
The building regs certificate does do that but it is not the only proof - the invoice by the engineer should suffice?
along with all the paper work he may have filled in.

These Building regs compliance certificates have only been issued for about 8 years or so.

But the Gas Safety Regs for landlords are 1998.

The GS cert issued would show that the LL had discharged his duties and employed a competent and qualified person in respect to GSIUR.

So would a CP12 issued at the time of installation. Has all required info on it.
LL is supposed to verify that credentials on documents marry up with identity of installer. ( badge

 

[lame plumber]

I only issue the building regs cert once Ive been paid in full, could this be the issue?

 

[PowerFlusher2]

Whatever you do you MUST address the problem (make the complaint) with Gas Safe Register within a year (assuming it remains unresolved) because after that time Gas Safe Register will not be interested. Within the 12 months they MIGHT be able to issue the certificate if they contact the installer and he confirms he did the job, and, of course, he remains a GSR. Why GSR can do no more than that is because they have no legal status and can take no other action than cancelling a GSR registration, but they WILL NOT do that because they then lose the membership fees. It is, actually, a criminal offence, since 2005, for a GSR NOT to register an installation he has completed but local building control will not pursue a case through the courts because an alternative method of acquiring the certificate is available if you pay them (GBP365.00p in our area) they will do the check, carry out the test and issue the certificate - and they might even use the GSR who did the job for you - if he is local - because they don't have any GSRs of their own! Obtaining the certificate, however, is the property owners problem. If the installer does the registration through GSR it costs him GBP2.50p. Absolutely LUDICROUS situation, isn't it?

 

[lame plumber]

not sure how not issung a building regs ticket can be a criminal offence! did their lordships introduce a act of parliment making it so recently, will the boys in blue be knocking on my door at dawn coz a farmer didnt want to pay me £2.50 for a ticket!!

 

[Reg Man]

If you do not follow the building control procedures set out for handling your building work or you carry out building work which does not comply with the requirements contained in the Building Regulations you will have contravened them. Failure to comply with the Building Regulations is a criminal offence and local authorities have the power to require the removal or alteration of completed work that does not comply with these requirements. The person carrying out work that contravenes the Building Regulations can be fined up to £5,000 per contravention, and £50 each day the contravention continues.

Can't see this ever happening, but who knows? (information is from the government portal)

 

[lame plumber]

if you install a boiler correctly how can anyone do you for not filling out a form thehouseholder is ultimately responsible for completing, all you can do is lose you gsr ticket for not complying with their policy!

 

[REDSAW]

i always get mine done within 6months!

 

[Reg Man]

if you install a boiler correctly how can anyone do you for not filling out a form thehouseholder is ultimately responsible for completing, all you can do is lose you gsr ticket for not complying with their policy!

Its the process driven world we live in.

 

[Ermintrude]

You may be surprised I had argument ( me - never) with gas safe about this , desk jockey at other end asked if he was competent ( as in gsr technical help) I said not sure , he assured me that he was more qualified than I, I asked if he was registered as an installer or had fga, he changed subject to how competence could be measured!
Gas safe is rubbish , slightly better than the old boys club Called corgi.

 

[Reg Man]

You may be surprised I had argument ( me - never) with gas safe about this , desk jockey at other end asked if he was competent ( as in gsr technical help) I said not sure , he assured me that he was more qualified than I, I asked if he was registered as an installer or had fga, he changed subject to how competence could be measured!
Gas safe is rubbish , slightly better than the old boys club Called corgi.

Don't go down this route you will be blown out of the water and sunk deeper than the Titanic.

 

[Ermintrude]

Ok point taken. Backing off toward the door.......

 

[Reg Man]

Ok point taken. Backing off toward the door.......

No problems mate. That's what the forums about.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

If you do not follow the building control procedures set out for handling your building work or you carry out building work which does not comply with the requirements contained in the Building Regulations you will have contravened them. Failure to comply with the Building Regulations is a criminal offence and local authorities have the power to require the removal or alteration of completed work that does not comply with these requirements. The person carrying out work that contravenes the Building Regulations can be fined up to £5,000 per contravention, and £50 each day the contravention continues.

I remember you posting a link to this ages ago - which shows that the person doing the work is responsible for making sure it complies with Building Regs.
Really useful.
BUT
Isn't it the homeowner who is responsible for notification?
Yes notifiable work MUST be notified - that is the law but I thought it wa the homeowners responsibility
but obviously heating installers offer this service as it is is cheap and easy to do it that way.

I have no time now to look up a reference for this but perhaps someone else can confirm one way or the other.

 

[Reg Man]

I remember you posting a link to this ages ago - which shows that the person doing the work is responsible for making sure it complies with Building Regs.
Really useful.
BUT
Isn't it the homeowner who is responsible for notification?
Yes notifiable work MUST be notified - that is the law but I thought it wa the homeowners responsibility
but obviously heating installers offer this service as it is is cheap and easy to do it that way.

I have no time now to look up a reference for this but perhaps someone else can confirm one way or the other.

Yes Tara your absolutely correct, it is ultimately the home owners responsibility, but that's one of the reasons it encourages them to use the proper registered trades people who can register the work for them. If they have gone down the correct route they should expect that work to be registered by the tradesman they have used.

 

[lame plumber]

it may be nothing, but our op has yet to answer the questions asked re did he pay the installer!!!!!!

 

[Ermintrude]

it may be nothing, but our op has yet to answer the questions asked re did he pay the installer!!!!!!

Yeh I kept hinting at this...,, suspicious really? Wouldn't ever say why. I know everyone falls on hard times but landlords and letting agents should always pay upfront !

 

[PowerFlusher2]

not sure how not issung a building regs ticket can be a criminal offence! did their lordships introduce a act of parliment making it so recently, will the boys in blue be knocking on my door at dawn coz a farmer didnt want to pay me £2.50 for a ticket!!

Not recently, on 1st April 2005 - surely Gas Safe tell you this as part of your update courses?