I'm a technical engineer for a prestigious company. It begins with b!

[Guest123]

It's time for this industry to be far more heavily regulated. To stop the flood of fast track earners believing this is an easy game with high earnings, the training schools need to be reigned in and forced to tell the truth in their advertisising. Plus I believe regulations should be put in place where fast track plumbers doing very short courses should not be allowed to work alone and unsupervised and should go through a probation period where their work is vetted. When they reach the required standard, they can then work alone. Quite similar to Gas Safe registration and might force down the huge numbers of new self employed plumbers in every area that have brand new vans and no work.

I'm NOT against fast track plumbers, but there are far too many competing for work in an industry where work is tight.

 

[mountainman]

I wouldn't mind being in 30k a year!

 

[Bernie2]

Hmm!

What a moaning lot!!! I also moaned about the same things 40 odd years ago and more. This game has never been high paid as Tamz said. Unless of course as Tamz also said you want to chase the cash. The ACS, Gas Regs and Gas Safe scheme though have piled up responsibilities which in the past although there were not so much pushed forward and certainly no fancy prices where attached to them.


Just as interest not as a moan. As an apprentice in the early 60's I worked 45 hour 5 1/2 day week as standard. The wages for an apprentice were, usually about £1.15p a week. If on local or site work you were usually required to use handcarts as well. The thing is local could be up to 5 miles away. The game is not so physically demanding like that now, thankfully. The difference today is all the responsibility paper and exam passing pressures put on the worker. That in itself makes up for the pushing of handcarts.

Somebody once said to me "The difference between a Plumber and a labourer is one uses tools and the other doesn't"

 

[Guest123]

Hmm!

What a moaning lot!!!

I know, but the plumbers on this forum care enough to come on here and spend time talking about their work, which says a lot of good things about their work ethics. Most of us are in this to make a living, we'll never be rich doing this, but when we feel that our livelihood is being threatened, it brings out the Victor Meldrew in us all.

One Foot in the Grave should have been written by plumbers.

 

[ecowarm]

One foot in the grave and scrambling to get out

 

[Deleted member 32524]

I agree that we are earning too little. However, I wold also say that we do it to ourselves!! I am always coming up against competitors who are charging penny's. We are out there putting our own liability on the line each day with the threat of killing someone if we make a silly mistake and end up in prison. in addition to that we have to pay for exams, insurance, vans etc, etc. Running costs are going up and engineers are cutting what they earn to stay competitive. Too many newbies. I strongly believe that I should set up a training company in Glasgow and start earning from my experience as in the field its value is going down. Government do not care what we earn as long as people are in training courses and not on the unemployment register, its all good?!

Ask any taxi driver that has been in the game over 10 yrs and they will let you know the way our industry is going.

 

[Bernie2]

The problem is the whole country is flat. Once they start building again work will no doubt pick up. The bigger worry for prices is the big outfits moving in, as somebody said even Tescos may get involved. The government does not mind this at all, all the competition keeps the prices down. The regs pay for all the ACS colleges and GasSafe fees pay for the government to police it. Its just what governments want. The guy who does the work gets beat up by them all, if your self employed you fight to get a good price, if your employed your boss fights with you to cover his or her costs of employing you. It would be a lot better if the industries big earners paid a bit more toward subsidising free or low cost training for everybody instead of waltzing away with all the money.

 

[secret squirrel]

Everyone thinks there underpaid. I'm not saying that we're not nor anyone else for that matter.

I had a conversation with a nurse, she said she was underpaid etc. I asked how much does she want, she couldn't answer, 40k enough? well, she didn't really know if that was too much or too little.

Fireman £30k for sitting around polishing an engine! yes I know its dangerous and not belittling what they do but they get paid for what they MAY have to deal with, rarely do they have to do it and definetly not on a daily basis. (thankfully)

Postmen, well they used to get paid overtime within there 8 hour working day and now they're moaning.

Police, now having to or shortly will have to pay for travel on public transport, dental care, having there pensions messed up.

The list is endless, that is unless your a politician!

My point is as someone else said 'its the sign of the times' when things are good no one moans and no one cares but when we're all fighting after scraps then....... well, then we all moan about money.

That is unless your a politician and you skim off of the top every chance you get, sorry did I mention politician.

On a final note when the market turns (and it will) site plumbers will go back, some/most fast trackers will go back to there old jobs in banking or whatever and we'll be still here!

You can see it here on the forum, same names pop up all the time, lots of people cruising in and out but generally the same names.

Have I mentioned politicians....

Long live Squirrel and thats my final word.

 

[scotty plumber]

It's time for this industry to be far more heavily regulated. To stop the flood of fast track earners believing this is an easy game with high earnings, the training schools need to be reigned in and forced to tell the truth in their advertisising. Plus I believe regulations should be put in place where fast track plumbers doing very short courses should not be allowed to work alone and unsupervised and should go through a probation period where their work is vetted. When they reach the required standard, they can then work alone. Quite similar to Gas Safe registration and might force down the huge numbers of new self employed plumbers in every area that have brand new vans and no work.

I'm NOT against fast track plumbers, but there are far too many competing for work in an industry where work is tight.

Well said System3!

 

[Millsy 82]

This trade has never been well paid. It has always been on par with other trades. Just below the average wages. Yes there are ways to make double that (or more) but those jobs are usually for the top guys who are willing to chase the money, put in the hard graft and the hours. Certainly not the stuff to suit a family man unless you are looking for a way out.
If you are on above average wages which are around 27k and a bit higher in London you are doing ok.
What has changed though is the amount of regulation and responsibility that is passed to employees. This should make us better paid in comparison to other trades but it never will.
You want bigger wages the only way to get them is work harder faster and longer for them. The way it has always been.

I dont mind the amount of money I am earning I have enough to pay all my bills and have a little left over after for beer money, But if somebody was to offer me more I wouldnt turn it down, I have had big money jobs when on price work earning 1k a week but as you said you have to work the hours to do it I was starting 6am and finishing 9-10pm it was good for a few months but couldnt do it any longer as it interferes in your life so much.

What annoys me though is all I do is gas service and maintenance (I went for the easier life) and there are so many idiots out there who cant do the job (Not just 8 weekers but people who generally dont have a clue) They pay their money go to an ACS training center who will pretty much make them pass (If they didnt though people would go to 1 that will) so we have alot of incompetant so called competant people who are on the same wages as those who can do the job, ACS is if you can read you pass simple as that there should be harder closed book questions to wittle these idiots out. (I know that when you start out with gas everything is challenging but how many people do you know who have passed their ACS and you think how the hell?)

 

[hammers4spanner]

I think people have to generally accept that the bubble has burst ,the training centers have ruined the game imho passing idiots who somehow manage to get positions in national companies or councils .I was talking to the counter staff down my local merchants and they tell me see firms come and go all the time .
On top of that more responsibility passed on to the plumber more work ,expense of tools/van and more aggro from custs than ever before makes this trade a rather stressfull one , top this off in reduction in wages .

What annoys me tho is the fact i had done a full 4 year apprenticeship which now somehow doesnt seem to count for anything, you can slam plumber on your van without bever even touching a pipe , or get work through agency without them asking for quals or even leave the forces and get pension and a plumbing/gas cert .

been doing this for over twenty years and can honestly say its at its absolute worse and i point directly at the training centers for this.

 

[secret squirrel]

....When I said it was my final word, it obviously wasn't.....

Where there is money to be made then people will take advantage, eg. training schools of all descriptions. That is having a free market, if, someone thinks they can earn £40+k per year after doing a fast course then there foolish and haven't done any research. The vast majority of these sort of people will give it up quickly, as will the people who think this is easy money. So, the only people who'll win are the training organisations.

We all have our opinions about council plumbers and those who work for companies, I have seen appaling work done by so called professionals who've taken the 'full 4 year apprenticeship'. I seen work done by these 20 year professionals pluming in an unvented cylinder on the third floor of a house in 15mm plastic pipe. The householder wondering why it takes a lifetime to get hot water.

Another 20 year time served plumber who does a vented system to a combi conversion leaving a shower pump plumbed in and connected.

If a soldier (ex-squaddie myself) serves his country at 18 for 22 years and leaves with his meagre pension then why shouldn't the army or country train him to be a plumber.

My point is this 'this is competition, if your better, work cleaner, faster, more knowledgeable then you should have no problem beating the ex-squaddie, fast tracker. However, if your overpriced, work is shoddy, you swear don't turn up when you say, don't do what you say you can do, increase the price after the job is done, then you need to be careful'

The days of plumbers going 'tut tut, ooooohhhh, I'll be here sometime next friday, it'll cost about £xxxx' are finished.

The old school plumbers, some very good, others getting by on Grandfather's rights need to either change there approach or go the way of the dinosaur.

 

[hammers4spanner]

the five pipe system totally changed it for the plumber gas fitter as easy to install system and 1 or 2 a day heat packs meaning suddenly money in the game.

if your on the books and happy doing 6 services a day for £115 then cant see why you can moan about lack of money .

Disagree tho with someones country re-training some as i see it as an 16 year olds perspective it immediately gives an unfair advantage , leave the forces retrained money to buy van ,tools, advertising whereas the apprentice has to save on a meagre wage at best to try set themselves up.

As i live in service town i see the unfair advantage of this all the time , am not saying that you cant retrain but its not a profession these peoiple choose from school and yet get mahoosive advantage over those that choose to plumb .