what you guys think

[supper plumb]

i found this little post one a rorum as i was having a look about just thought id shear it with you guys....


Sorry if this has been discussed to death before but here is the scenario:

One of my relatives has had their boiler spring a leak - they've had nothing but trouble with it. They have a contract with British Gas to keep it going but have had enough of it breaking down on them.

My relative suggested to the BG engineer that he'd be better off getting it replaced. He had a silly quote from BG to do it but the BG engineer said he could do it out of work hours for a greatly reduced price as a cash job.

Now he's also told my relative that he will sort out the paperwork and he'll get everything apart from the GasSafe certificate which won't be a problem as the HIPs system is no longer running so he doesn't need to have the GasSafe certificate.

I was under the impression that BG engineers were covered by British Gas themselves under their registration and any work carried out outside BG contract was not certifiable.

Now if the BG engineer did this job as a "homer", would the boiler warranty be valid ? It would probably be a WB boiler. If there was a gas leak or something and an insurance claim was needed, what comeback would my relative have ? Would the installer have his own Gas Safe registration number or would he be covered under a blanket BG number ?

Sorry for all the questions but I've just spent the past 30 minutes on the phone trying to argue with my relative that its really not a great idea.

 

[snowhead]

The BG engineer is not covered under his employers Gassafe reg to do any work other than for them
It may also be that BG do not allow their employees to have their own Gassafe reg, which is what he would need.

Tell the relative to get quotes from independant Gassafe reg engineers, it'll probably be cheaper than the "Homer"

Just noticed, it's not YOUR relative!!

 

[Destroyer2813]

Bad Bad Bad illegal idea the fitter wont have his own gs safe number ( i am led to beleve they arnt allowed to keep their own number ) no public liabilty insurance and you know most of the money your relative gives him will be pure beer money as Bg will have supplied most of the bits without knowing about it. Tell your relative to get independent quotes where do they live you know anyone who you could get quotes for them

 

[julesverne]

Also report the bg engineer for offering homers its unfair competition and illegal.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

Also report the bg engineer for offering homers its unfair competition and illegal.

I would like to LIKE LIKE LIKE this!

Report him to BG - get him the sack and then see how he likes it when he is competing for work on the open market with all the business over heads like the rest of us!


As said: Certification is a legal requirement under Building Regulations, nothing to do with HIP.
If and when they sold the house the solicitor would want a copy of that CErt.
No GSR so it is infact an illegal installation.
If he had GSR in his own right he would be able to register the boiler so clearly he hasn't got it.
And NO public liability insurance.

Not sure if warranty would be invalid though. Just tell your relative it would be!

I expect he is offering a reallly attractive cheap deal but point out it is not so cheap when it could cost hundreds of pounds to get it recommissioned and notified under building control. And no warranty could also work out expensive.

Also - is your relative committing a criminal offence by knowing employing someone who is not GSR? Certainly if they were the landlord and it was in a rented property they would be.
And if it was a work place they would be.
But I am not sure about a homeowner employing someone in their own home.

 

[Reg Man]

BG would be none to happy, having potential work poached by their work force. Gross misconduct, illegal? Still a requirement of building regulations to get a certificate.

 

[villa_tom]

I would like to LIKE LIKE LIKE this!

Report him to BG - get him the sack and then see how he likes it when he is competing for work on the open market with all the business over heads like the rest of us!

why on earth would you like to see someone get the sack??

Anyone should be reported for doing work without the appropriate insurances and gas safe etc etc. But the bloke just needs to be told about the wrongs of what he's doing and leave it at that.

To wish someone the sack when getting a job is hard enough is stupid and a terrible attitude to have.

 

[villa_tom]

BG would be none to happy, having potential work poached by their work force. Gross misconduct, illegal? Still a requirement of building regulations to get a certificate.

BG lads are not allowed to do their own work and they get in all sorts of bother if they do it even if they do a job that BG themselves don't do.

Its fair enough really, especially if they don't have their own gas safe etc.

even when I worked at the council direct I wasn't allowed to do private stuff, I don't think many firms look kindly on it to be fair.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

why on earth would you like to see someone get the sack??

Anyone should be reported for doing work without the appropriate insurances and gas safe etc etc. But the bloke just needs to be told about the wrongs of what he's doing and leave it at that.

To wish someone the sack when getting a job is hard enough is stupid and a terrible attitude to have.

OK may be that seems a bit harsh and a bit mean - which is totally not like me.

On the other hand.
Mr TP has aid to do all his training.
We've paid for our GS registration this year and every year.
We've paid for public liability insurance.
We've invested in equipment, vans and advertising.
We pay reluctantly collect VAT by adding it to the cost of labour and handing it over the HMRC.
We pay an accountant to work out our final tax bill and make sure we've declared every penny to HMRC....

I don't really mind if someone with not one of those expenses does an illegal boiler install at the weekend so they can have some extra money. No it doesn't cause us any problem does it. It doesn't lose real business for legit businesses and drive prices down.

Just tell him not to do it again.
And anyone else also thinking of doing illegal gas work - why not let them all do it and just threaten to tell 'em off if they get caught.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

why on earth would you like to see someone get the sack??
.

Also Tom.
If anyone works for you as an employee or a subbie - you send them to a house and they do a private deal with the customer cutting you out the loop would you employ them again?
We wouldn't - same thing.

Wishing bad stuff to happen to people isn't normally my thing but guys who do this are masters of their own doom.

 

[stevetheplumber]

whilst it is wrong im sure weve all done the same or similar its the way most people get started on their own

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

very illegal also spell check would help

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

why on earth would you like to see someone get the sack??

Anyone should be reported for doing work without the appropriate insurances and gas safe etc etc. But the bloke just needs to be told about the wrongs of what he's doing and leave it at that.

To wish someone the sack when getting a job is hard enough is stupid and a terrible attitude to have.

your not self employed are you?anyone getting a wage and hobbling should get the bullet,we have massive overheads to deal with before we even compete,but its ok for you to do a homer,your attitude tom makes me sick

 

[hammers4spanner]

Serve the operative right if he got sacked imho

 

[Pssst]

Operative....?

 

[hammers4spanner]

yep

operative

 

[villa_tom]

your not self employed are you?anyone getting a wage and hobbling should get the bullet,we have massive overheads to deal with before we even compete,but its ok for you to do a homer,your attitude tom makes me sick

Sod off with your remarks mate.

I am self employed. I run a van myself, have my own registration and PLI and all the other nonsense that goes with being a contractor.

So keep your ill informed opinions to yourself and don't ever question what I say without even knowing all the facts.

I disagreed with wanting a bloke to get the sack, I didn't agree with what he was doing at all.

 

[mutley racers]

Wow easy chaps.

 

[villa_tom]

Wow easy chaps.

Im only defending myself mate. It's only fair when people are talking nonsense about me.

 

[mutley racers]

Nothing wrong with defending yourself. I just don't like to see 2 respected members having a little pop at each other. Just not used to it.

 

[TerryWaite]

why on earth would you like to see someone get the sack??

Anyone should be reported for doing work without the appropriate insurances and gas safe etc etc. But the bloke just needs to be told about the wrongs of what he's doing and leave it at that.

To wish someone the sack when getting a job is hard enough is stupid and a terrible attitude to have.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[glenno1]

He is doing wrong and he knows it, so if he gets sacked he has only 1 person to blame,but personally i would not snitch on him myself

 

[villa_tom]

He is doing wrong and he knows it, so if he gets sacked he has only 1 person to blame,but personally i would not snitch on him myself

Hes certainly doing wrong, there's no doubt about it and if he got sacked then that's his own fault, but to wish it upon someone is wrong in my eyes.

 

[TerryWaite]

Bit harsh with your remarks there gas man

 

[villa_tom]

Bit harsh with your remarks there gas man

And also wrong 🙂

 

[hammers4spanner]

Whats with the mud slinging ?

 

[villa_tom]

Whats with the mud slinging ?

I wouldn't call it mud slinging mate.

I just defended what I wrote, when someone says my attitude makes them sick because I don't want to see a bloke sacked then they can keep their opinion to themselves.

I don't mind anyone saying anything to me but when what they say is nonsense I'm naturally going to take offence.

The bloke knows nothing about me, yet makes assumptions about my employment status and say what I said makes him sick.

 

[lame plumber]

dont want to see anyone one sacked, but consider what he is doing, working illegally, any problems and he isnt insured so a fire in the custards house caused by him wouldnt be covered and not everyone has household cover on their homes!. He is stealing from his employer and theres no other way to put it, so overall its gross misconduct however you look at it. So if was me, Id report it and if he were sacked he only has himself to blame, it is a hard old world but I wouldnt shed any tears, after all he is also taking away a chance of income from the likes of you and me as well.

reference to arguements on the forum, leave it out lads, thats my arena you moving into🙂

 

[villa_tom]

dont want to see anyone one sacked, but consider what he is doing, working illegally, any problems and he isnt insured so a fire in the custards house caused by him wouldnt be covered and not everyone has household cover on their homes!. He is stealing from his employer and theres no other way to put it, so overall its gross misconduct however you look at it. So if was me, Id report it and if he were sacked he only has himself to blame, it is a hard old world but I wouldnt shed any tears, after all he is also taking away a chance of income from the likes of you and me as well.

reference to arguements on the forum, leave it out lads, thats my arena you moving into🙂

I hear what your saying I really do and I agree with all of it.

I just didnt agree with the attitude some people had of "get the bloke the sack"

no one knows anyone's circumstances and the bloke could be in desperate need of cash for whatever reason, we just don't know.

By doing these types of jobs he is walking a very thin line and if he ended up getting sacked then that's fair enough, but I wouldn't wish it upon him.

 

[Dotty]

Closing this thread to allow everyone to calm.

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

I wouldn't call it mud slinging mate.

I just defended what I wrote, when someone says my attitude makes them sick because I don't want to see a bloke sacked then they can keep their opinion to themselves.

I don't mind anyone saying anything to me but when what they say is nonsense I'm naturally going to take offence.

The bloke knows nothing about me, yet makes assumptions about my employment status and say what I said makes him sick.

and you know absolutely nothing about me,if i was you i would keep your comments to yourself