Benefits of Power Flushing

[village idiot]

for all those who insist that power flushing is a requirement, I will like them to explain to me how this would have helped/worked in this scenario?



The picture you are seeing is a 22mm pipework on a gravity system that I converted to a Combi as per customers request.
The internal bore is only about 5mm and even less in some areas. So how is the use of a power flushing machine helpful here?

 

[Meady]

How old is that system???

 

[village idiot]

How old is that system???

29 Years old

 

[AWheating]

i dont get what your asking? are you saying that you would leave that pipework in and try and clean it?

 

[Meady]

29 Years old

Served them well I guess then, what was your solution to fix it in the end?

 

[village idiot]

i dont get what your asking? are you saying that you would leave that pipework in and try and clean it?

ofcourse not. I am saying that you have to access the situation and decide on what is the best option to proceed.
In the above case, I repiped the system.
As far as I am concerned, you can power flush that till ''thy kingdom come'', you will not be able to shift a great majority of the built up sludge. Infact, you will only make the situation worse.

 

[Best]

Something must have been seriously wrong with that system, - even at 29 years old?
Nothing better than my preferred way of dealing with badly scaled pipes & radiators - remove them to the scrap man & put the money a power flush would have cost towards new rads & pipes.

 

[AWheating]

ofcourse not. I am saying that you have to access the situation and decide on what is the best option to proceed.
In the above case, I repiped the system.
As far as I am concerned, you can power flush that till ''thy kingdom come'', you will not be able to shift a great majority of the built up sludge. Infact, you will only make the situation worse.

i agree, before deciding what work and flushing method may be needed a proper inspection of the system is required. This is why i find it funny when i get told by people "ive been told in dont need a powerflush because the rads dont look very old" or you hear the statement " i fitted a magnaclean so it doesnt need flushing" etc, etc......

In many cases you may not know what extend the systems condition is untill work begins. you may be required to powerflush, mains flush, repipe even. Keep your options open and keep your customers minds open to the possible need of such work imo.

 

[village idiot]

Funny you should mention the scap man.
Half way through the first day of the install, the custard comes in and tells me that ''they want all the copper pipes and the cylinder as they will scrap it themselves''.

So I had to leave every bit of rubbish I removed. But they had something to be proud of:
- I cut the cylinder primaries as far up as I could on the cylinder and cut the cold feed to cylinder quite high up (about 3/4 way up the tank). Then just manouvered tank out of airing cupboard and left it by the side at top of stairs.
- Boiler pipes F+R were 28mm pipes. I cut these just above boiler and did not drain down boiler. I moved boiler to one side.

When I came in the following day, she had a ''face like thunder''. In their attempt to move cylinder and boiler downstairs, they manged to give the stairs carpet a nice dose of black sludge. BRILLIANT. She accused me of not telling them that the boiler and cylinder was quite heavy and could damage carpet? Well, I never told them to do anything, did I?

When I finished the job, I charged an extra £100 to cover for unforeseen problems. I had to make up my lost 'bonus money' from the lost scrap. Had they let me keep the scrap, they would have been better off. Besides, I would have got less than £100 for the scrap.

 

[AWheating]

i put into my written quotes a discount for the removal of scrap. Then if the customer states they want the scrap i remove the discount from the price.

 

[village idiot]

I would prefer the customer to inform me at the quotation stage that they want to keep all their scrap. Then I know to add at least £75 to the quote. In October, I fitted a Combi to a customer in Streatham. After handing over, she wanted to know wher I had placed the ''big thing''? It turned out she was refering to the hot water cylinder. Oh, I scrapped it.
All hell break loose. The junior sister accused me of coming into peoples houses and taking things?
On day one, no one said anything. After copletion and handing over on day two, then this happened. I asked why she wanted the cylinder? She said she wanted to make pots out of it. Strange people

 

[acecharly]

When i worked on the QE2 refit we had a 6" galv ring main that feed all the rooms on the ship. It took water from the sea and desalinated it and made it fit for consumption. Part of the refit was to change it over and that 6" pipe had about 1 1/2" left inside with all the caking inside and weighed a ton when w took it out piece by piece.

 

[Ermintrude]

When custards ask to keep scrap they pay for decommissioning or they do it at own peril. I love it when on day two their mates have said to keep the boiler as it's worth £100's . I take copper and the brass they get cast e type on second floor ! Wnkrs

 

[A1P]

i agree, before deciding what work and flushing method may be needed a proper inspection of the system is required. This is why i find it funny when i get told by people "ive been told in dont need a powerflush because the rads dont look very old" or you hear the statement " i fitted a magnaclean so it doesnt need flushing" etc, etc......

In many cases you may not know what extend the systems condition is untill work begins. you may be required to powerflush, mains flush, repipe even. Keep your options open and keep your customers minds open to the possible need of such work imo.

I totally agree.Each situation needs to be assessed.It is possible to test before making a decision.I recommend cleaning the system on all boiler swaps.This ,as has been said on many previous threads ,doesn't necessarily mean a powerflush.I inform customers that I will advise on what is required and price accordingly.There are a few systems as in the OP where replacement is the only sensible option.

 

[Ermintrude]

for all those who insist that power flushing is a requirement, I will like them to explain to me how this would have helped/worked in this scenario?

View attachment 17710

The picture you are seeing is a 22mm pipework on a gravity system that I converted to a Combi as per customers request.
The internal bore is only about 5mm and even less in some areas. So how is the use of a power flushing machine helpful here?

This the cold fill or pre pump section? I have struggled with pipes when bbu boiled dry and pipes coated . I would dissolve with 50% Hcl for 20 mins out pump on reverse flow with mag vibrated and some x800 cleared some 1920's 4" iron lines that had 50% restrictions , tees off bottom of run that had been dead but were required to be back on. Asbestos lagging so stripping last resort as mega money ! 4no 50m runs on groundfloor of private education facility - owner tight!


Asbestos pipes should never be mechanically disturbed or vibrated

 

[mutley racers]

I never ask the client if they want the scrap. I just always take it. I have never had one ask to keep it yet. I was close yesterday though. Pulling out the cylinder and talking to myself how it is going to be a nice little earner. Low and behold and the custard is behind me and says 'oh, are they worth money then?'. I'm like yep £30 and into the van it goes

 

[Ermintrude]

I seem to get a lot of scrap keepers, shame really job costs them extra £250 for £80 of loot!

 

[Best]

I never ask the client if they want the scrap. I just always take it. I have never had one ask to keep it yet. I was close yesterday though. Pulling out the cylinder and talking to myself how it is going to be a nice little earner. Low and behold and the custard is behind me and says 'oh, are they worth money then?'. I'm like yep £30 and into the van it goes

Better to be upfront nowadays about scrap. A lot of people know about metals being worth money & if the customer doesn't, you can bet that they soon will be told by somebody & you will look like a thief if you sneaked it away. It is their property after all.

 

[IDCHAPPY]

I seem to get a lot of scrap keepers, shame really job costs them extra £250 for £80 of loot!

Excellent 😀

 

[Ermintrude]

Excellent 😀

Honestly I detest them! I ask at start if job and make out that it will be included for within the quote and if they remove it and they damage or make my life harder it's going to be expensive. We have really started to ride some custards who we don't want jobs. 4 lads charged out at £75 each, as soon as a problem due to removal of scrap. Dosnt matter that 2 of then apprentices and other two couldn't produce £75 p/w worth of work!! I'm beginning to sound like a rogue but I'm just sick of people taking the rizz. Today however we re pipes and relocated two rads 4m away for a continual supply of tea and bacon sarnies!