(co) bigger killer now or 20 years ago

[nicro3]

As previously posted most co deaths are suicides.

 

[Reg Man]

As previously posted most co deaths are suicides.

Sorry, but general CO suicides, are not included in the Advantica stat's.

 

[Reg Man]

Advantica collect statisics on CO poisonings, related to piped gas incidents. This is collected from investigations of this type. The 20'ish deaths a year, are based on these records.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

Gas fires with and without catalytic converters scare me and make me paranoid when installing to the point where i really dont want to.......am i alone or does anyone else share this view..........i know my installations are safe as i check and check again, but i still have that what if?......and so usually decline the invitation to install saying im too busy.

I am writing a book on gas fires. Research is all done & it is almost finished ... I would be happy to email you a draft when it is ready.
When you see all the research gathered together in one place I don't think you will ever fit a flueless fire again.
I think they are probably fine - so long as they are not turned on and definitely not used as a heat source!
My gsr business do not do fires so I would really like a few guys who do fit fires to read through...

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

CO accidental fatality figures are wonderfully low and fallen dramatically over past 15 years.<br>Perhaps due to better public education?<br><br>But they do not include injury / poison incidents which are high.<br>Dept of Health est 4,000 incidents of CO poisoning annually (based on A&amp;E attendance).<br>Problem of under estimating as it is rarely tested for (via blood test) it is diagnosed just based on the evidence, so CO has to be suspected.<br>Of course the symptoms could be mistaken for flue, stress, etc...<br><br>less than 10 years ago there was a study in south east england that found a quarter of gas fires were AR or ID - due to lack of maintenance.<br>CO is associated with cookers and often reaches high levels, but people don't know this and a good number will be using their gas cooker to provide heating.<br>And then there was just a recent study in to CO last year - showing high levels of CO in a number of homes, residents were not aware.<br>http://www.ljmu.ac.uk/NewsUpdate/index_123350.htm<br><br>Those levels are not going to kill but can cause long term, permanent health problems.<br><br>Some CO may be due to other fuels, lighting a BBQ in the kitchen of using a petrol generator in the home! <br>But something like 95% of homes in the UK have gas heating so really CO is still a big problem.<br>And the vast majority of these poisonings would not happen is people had gas appliances installed and regularly serviced/checked by gsr engineer.<br><br>Rant over.<br>PS. I 've got no idea what the OP was about! 🙂<br><br><br>

 

[Reg Man]

Tip of the ice berg. I suspect there is so much under reporting of RIDDOR through CO relayed issues, that the stat's do not reflect the true picture.

 

[lame plumber]

if the gov researched and provided proper stats they would have to do something ie ban sale of gas products to diy and that isnt happening anytime soon

 

[Reg Man]

if the gov researched and provided proper stats they would have to do something ie ban sale of gas products to diy and that isnt happening anytime soon

It will never happen, freedom of trade and all that.

Just because a person buys a gas appliance it does not mean they will install it. Where do you draw the line. Gas Barbeques? Portable gas heaters? freestanding Cookers?

Unfortunately there are those out there that think they can do what ever they want, with no regard for legislation. Competents! Reg 3 GSIUR

 

[Gary71]

I think we've taken a step back with gas safety due to the lack of air pressure switches on gas boilers, APS were always handy for identifying flue faults as well as a flame picture.

A unconverted Vitodens with a working pressure of 70 mbar was very nearly the end of me last year, I'd advise any gas fitter to get a personal carbon monoxide alarm as mine saved me that day.

 

[Toxic Ted]

Im reading too many reports of gsr fitter being saved by personal CO alarms so it seems i had better get one sharpish......wonder if ray will do an offer for forum members?

 

[AWheating]

corgi do one for about £45.

 

[Pssst]

ESPs dont provide CO/Atmospheric detectors for its Engineers although i think one is now issuing PAMs (personal atmospheric monitors).I wonder how it can be considered safe to send an ESP bod to fumes/reports of CO and yet he has no means to safeguard himself?

 

[Reg Man]

ESPs dont provide CO/Atmospheric detectors for its Engineers although i think one is now issuing PAMs (personal atmospheric monitors).I wonder how it can be considered safe to send an ESP bod to fumes/reports of CO and yet he has no means to safeguard himself?

A CO incident a coulpe of years ago, in South Wales, involved the ESP man being overcome by CO in a cellar of a commerical office block. No personal CO detector. Can't understand why the ESP don't issue them out as a norm. But may be they do now?
The cause was a domestic GSR engineer changed the gas valve, the day before, on a commercial atmosphereic boiler and did not set the burner pressure or check the gas rate properly, this as well as defective ventialtion was the cause.

 

[tamz]

SGN (Scotland) have been issuing them for a while now. Maybe southern do to as they are part of the same group.

 

[Gasmancoops]

I believe all of the ESP's were looking at this issue and most were considering personal alarms for their first call operatives. However politically they did not want to go down the route of issue CO detectors or analysers for responding to reports of fumes/CO alarm activation as this opens up a whole new skill level for their staff which would involve training and all sorts of additional costs to them.

By issuing personal alarms only they can remain as TOFO's and just make safe.

 

[nicro3]

Sorry, but general CO suicides, are not included in the Advantica stat's.

Incorrect ! the biggest cause of CO deaths in this country are suicides. In the UK in 2012 there where over 6000 suicides, by far the most used method was CO poisoning

 

[tamz]

Incorrect ! the biggest cause of CO deaths in this country are suicides. In the UK in 2012 there where over 6000 suicides, by far the most used method was CO poisoning

Obviously not by sticking your head in the oven.
Hose in the car window will do that one so it is highly unlikely to be included in any Advantica reports.

 

[nicro3]

Exactly, read previous posts !!Obviously not by sticking your head in the oven.
Hose in the car window will do that one so it is highly unlikely to be included in any Advantica reports.

Read more: http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/g...-killer-now-20-years-ago-3.html#ixzz2NeFpDYly
​

 

[tamz]

I did read them and the comment was about Advantica collated gas related incidents which obviously doesn't cover some unfortunate who can't pay their bills topping themselves in the garage.
Advantica used to collate the information but it has now seemingly been passed to the Cross Government Group on Gas Safety and Carbon Monoxide Awareness.
Suicides, however they are carried out, do not fall into this category.
Read http://www.hse.gov.uk/gas/domestic/cross-government-group-1011.pdf
The relevant information is near the end.

 

[simon0703]

Hate them too, fires are a grey area in my opinion. Got the new next book the other day and they are selling bioethonol fires. Apparently clean burning does not need vent or flue. That's a accident waiting to happen