Dadaaa ! In know some - hit ha ha . Kop
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- condensate pipe size
View the thread, titled "External condensate pipe size" which is posted in UK Plumbers Forums on UK Plumbers Forums.
A
Aire
The way I read that is there is a maximum length if you terminate below the gully grate or into a condensate soakaway. If you was to leave a gap between the outlet and the gully grate then no length restrictions apply?
Well, that seems to be giving me even more to think about.....
Might just leave it as is.
Might just leave it as is.
The way I read it is that the "no length restrictions" only applies if you are connecting to something along the lines of a sink or washing machine waste. When connecting to a soakaway or a gulley max run of the external pipe is 3m.
A
Aire
Yes I can see that and not arguing about the fact, but is says when terminating in a gully below grid level and above the water level then a keep pipe length to a minimum and should not not be more than 3 metres. What I asked was, if for example you have no gully less than 3m away, you can't for whatever reason fit a soak away. If you terminate the outlet above the gully grate, does the maximum length still apply? As the instructions aren't specifically clear on this. It doesn't say maximum length is 3m, it's only says when terminating below gully grate.
TBH I would leave it alone 11/2 will freeze had loads last winter if yours didn't freeze it's good
I can't see a bit of black armaflex insulation putting people off that much
I can't see a bit of black armaflex insulation putting people off that much
i thought you were not allowed to terminate above the gully grate?
I think the point was that you should A terminate below the gully grate and B terminate above the water level. As with any waste pipe running into a gully.
3m fact! above or below ie into a drain or a soakway. Kop
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You sure Ron ?
A
Aire
Just checked on this and you DO have to terminate the pipe below the grate. This is to prevent wind chill freezing the pipe. Also recommends drain guards to be fitted which I guess is 1 to stop the gully clogging with leaves etc and 2 to stop the gully filling with snow which will inevitably freeze the pipe.
Again I wasn't disputing facts or anything, if I ask a question it's only for my own knowledge, not to question others.
W
Welder
Be prepared... 🙄
Interestingly, when Corgi introduced the larger dia condensate it did very little to reduce freezing. What it did do however was delay the BLOCKING of the pipework because a 40mm dia pipe has 4 x the capacity of a 20mm dia pipe. The insulation also slowed, by a smidge, the initial freezing but literally by less than ten minutes.
What Corgi never took into account was the circulatory air currents that occur in a larger dia pipe - but we won't go into that 😡
The reasons condensate freezes so readily is because in the UK we do not run our boilers in perm condensing mode. If we did it would be far less of an issue. So, running them as we do we get literal drops of condensate flowing every so often. As drops of water contain virtually zero sensible heat to give up they soon transfer it into the open atmosphere of the pipe. At 4 degs C and below they then give up their even smaller amounts of latent heat and change state to ice and we have the start of a freeze.
The only ways to stop external pipework like this freezing is:
- replace the heat lost to atmosphere via trace heating
- move sufficient volume of water in one go that, ultimately, it simply does not have time to lose its heat before reaching its destination.
Be under no illusion, insulation can NEVER stop freezing all it does is reduce the loss of the contained within the fluid. Unfortunately, corgi did not even know that if you are trying to protect against freezing you cannot leave ANY gaps and that the volume of fluid must be closely enclosed. As I write this I begin to realise that they might have indeed understood and simply played a game with installers to try to be seen to be doing something that they ultimately knew would be ineffective - who knows.
So, in summary, and not withstanding other great advice like protecting plastic pipe against UV by painting (shocking to need to do it in my view), personally I'd look at fitting a condensate pump with an interlock (for the boiler) and I'd run the discharge internally through the back of the cupboards to an internal waste. It would be darned simple and not be seen.
Other than that, I'd still fit the pump but I'd discharge it into some 21mm externally. So long as the boiler interlock with the pump works, I do not believe there will be a problem. Even if the pump failed, you could then do a temp discharge into a plastic drum to be manually emptied every 4 hours so keeping the boiler running at all times
I apologise for my alternative views chaps 🙂
Interestingly, when Corgi introduced the larger dia condensate it did very little to reduce freezing. What it did do however was delay the BLOCKING of the pipework because a 40mm dia pipe has 4 x the capacity of a 20mm dia pipe. The insulation also slowed, by a smidge, the initial freezing but literally by less than ten minutes.
What Corgi never took into account was the circulatory air currents that occur in a larger dia pipe - but we won't go into that 😡
The reasons condensate freezes so readily is because in the UK we do not run our boilers in perm condensing mode. If we did it would be far less of an issue. So, running them as we do we get literal drops of condensate flowing every so often. As drops of water contain virtually zero sensible heat to give up they soon transfer it into the open atmosphere of the pipe. At 4 degs C and below they then give up their even smaller amounts of latent heat and change state to ice and we have the start of a freeze.
The only ways to stop external pipework like this freezing is:
- replace the heat lost to atmosphere via trace heating
- move sufficient volume of water in one go that, ultimately, it simply does not have time to lose its heat before reaching its destination.
Be under no illusion, insulation can NEVER stop freezing all it does is reduce the loss of the contained within the fluid. Unfortunately, corgi did not even know that if you are trying to protect against freezing you cannot leave ANY gaps and that the volume of fluid must be closely enclosed. As I write this I begin to realise that they might have indeed understood and simply played a game with installers to try to be seen to be doing something that they ultimately knew would be ineffective - who knows.
So, in summary, and not withstanding other great advice like protecting plastic pipe against UV by painting (shocking to need to do it in my view), personally I'd look at fitting a condensate pump with an interlock (for the boiler) and I'd run the discharge internally through the back of the cupboards to an internal waste. It would be darned simple and not be seen.
Other than that, I'd still fit the pump but I'd discharge it into some 21mm externally. So long as the boiler interlock with the pump works, I do not believe there will be a problem. Even if the pump failed, you could then do a temp discharge into a plastic drum to be manually emptied every 4 hours so keeping the boiler running at all times
I apologise for my alternative views chaps 🙂
No one can say you dont explain yourself Dave ha ha . Cheers kop
W
Welder
Thanks for all the interest in my question.
Having considered all input, I think I will just leave things as they are ( but maybe get feedback from potential tenants as to what they think of the black condensate pipe )
cheers 🙂
Having considered all input, I think I will just leave things as they are ( but maybe get feedback from potential tenants as to what they think of the black condensate pipe )
cheers 🙂
Or don't even mention it
O
Old Account
As long as you got a good fall that’s just in my opinion. I never came across a frozen 32mm KOP. I unfortunately have to also disagree on 3m in total. I really think what the mis states is external 3m in total but it could be longer for example, 2m inside, and 3 outside. That’s the way I see it.
So in this case ......................................................
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O
Old Account
That’s so true, most of the people do not understand that radiators with a smart controller don’t have to b3 roasting hot to achieve the desired temperature. The boiler would the work on its own when having weather comp. and a boiler which modulates. Set the boiler to 55 flow temperature and let it run even though it runs the whole day it will still use much less fuel than getting it up to 75 and the boiler starts and stops all day long. You can put it this way, you could drive a porsche from east London to Oxford street but burning 20l or using a fiat which uses 6l but for both cars it will take the same time.
I hope you get my point. But as soon as you install a modulating boiler with a smart controller which has wether comp. and you setup the flow temperature you can be sure people will call you back very soon especially in winter time because the rads aren’t roasting.
However, that’s my point of view. Anyone who wants to disagree there are more than welcome 🙂 I love collecting disagreements🙂
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