Need advise, dealing with a potential thief in the company

[Ray Stafford]

counter claim by a slimy lawyer for unfair dismissal

There is no access to a tribunal for unfair dismissal unless the OP exposes himself to it via one of protected categories (ie by sacking the guy for being black, gay, disabled, a union activist etc etc). If he just says "you are not suitable, goodbye", and pays the contractual notice, then that's that.

To summarily dismiss (ie without notice) would be harsh to my mind given the lack of "smoking gun" evidence.

I would not be inclined to set a trap. Sure, if he takes it, thats clear. But if he doesn't take it, that doesn't prove he is innocent. He may just have sussed out that its a trap. Or whatever devil it is that turns a good lad into a thief may not be in him today.

 

[Roger Welton]

Agree with ray, if you're convinced, get rid, not been with firm long enough so MUCH easier to do it now, here's you notice son sorry it didn't work out. If you are concerned about what he'll do during the month (or whatever his notice period is) then pay him for being on 'gardening leave'.

 

[tommy1712]

Just make it perfectly known that you know someone is on the rob and they will find them selfs with a good slap and no job when you catch them

 

[plumben]

as pointed out by some of the others he might have a gambling or drug problem or something else maybe take the lad aside and ask him if there's anything he needs help with

 

[Rickster123]

as pointed out by some of the others he might have a gambling or drug problem or something else maybe take the lad aside and ask him if there's anything he needs help with

I've got addictions but I don't go raiding the customers fridge and biscuit tin. It's called self control.

 

[rocketmanbkk]

I've got addictions but I don't go raiding the customers fridge and biscuit tin. It's called self control.

What about if you saw Jamie Dodgers?

Could you control yourself them

 

[Ray Stafford]

Doesn't need to be beyond reasonable doubt for an investigation to commence

If you go to the police with anything less than unequivocal CCTV evidence and a signed confession witnessed by the pope, then you are wasting your time.

 

[Ray Stafford]

What about if you saw Jamie Dodgers?

Could you control yourself them

salivates...

 

[newcastle phill]

And of course he could be innocent.
If other people have had access to the same area over the same time then they could also be thieves.
Its a hard call. But as said earlier - if your gonna get rid - just get rid. Keep it simple.

 

[Best]

I go with setting a trap. Then dismiss him if caught in the act.
It is then up to you if you tell anyone, or let him try employment elsewhere, free from a bad reputation as a thief.
He had his chance with you and he may have abused it and risked your reputation and company

 

[rocketmanbkk]

If you go to the police with anything less than unequivocal CCTV evidence and a signed confession witnessed by the pope, then you are wasting your time.

If reported the police have a duty to investigate the way they see fit. They might bin the case or they might take statements from all employees etc.

Who knows, I was with the police 10 years just over & there didn't seem to be much continuity how things were done. Depended on manpower, seriousness of crime, targets & stats!

It wasn't great & got worse hence I & many other civvies flew the nest. It was an eye opener to say the least

 

[plumben]

I've got addictions but I don't go raiding the customers fridge and biscuit tin. It's called self control.

Yes I completely agree but you never know people circumstances I'm not saying that it right but for all's we know the lads mum and/or dad could be seriously ill and the lads paying the bills,
on the other hand he might just be a scum bag who's been pinching fittings along with cash and is just a greedy bugger

 

[armyash]

Be interested to see read the outcome of this.

If he is a hard worker and reliable then he already possesses good qualities. Not that makes innocent but liars and thieves don't usually have these qualities as it's easier for them to lie and steal to get what they want rather than work for it.

Setting a trap is not ideal as you are putting temptation in his way but I would rather do that and find out 100% that he is a thief and that way you can get rid with a clear conscience and sleep well. I would rather do it that way than take someones word for it seeing as he is a good worker. If he takes the bait you can say see you later and feel satisfied you did the right thing. If you do set a trap I would keep it to yourself. Wouldn't even tell any longer serving more trusted employees.

I never fully trust tell tales anyway they are usually brown nosers or just trying to put someone down for their own gain.

Either way, hope it gets sorted. If he's a thief he will live to regret it when next month he is skint.

 

[rpm]

There is no access to a tribunal for unfair dismissal unless the OP exposes himself to it via one of protected categories (ie by sacking the guy for being black, gay, disabled, a union activist etc etc). If he just says "you are not suitable, goodbye", and pays the contractual notice, then that's that.

I`m sure you know the employment law a damm sight better than me Ray. So that`s good enough for me.

 

[tommy1712]

Anyone that works for me gets told straight for day one no lies, no stealing and keep your eyes off customers stuff in there homes it's as simple as that

 

[stevetheplumber]

if you set a trap unless you camera it ,its pointless as once he has the bait you have no legal right to search him and you would have to call the police then its his word against yours
as ray has said if your sure in your mind its him i would just let him go now rather than later

 

[lame plumber]

I have had to bin employees for theft in a previous role. Some were caught with property not belonging to them leaving work, no issues, gross misconduct and seen off premises, paid upto that day. Another was like you, always on scene, only one with access etc etc, called them in, gave them a weeks notice and off, no reason just they werent meeting our requirements during their probation period, funnily enough nothing else went missing. Horrible to do, but would you take someone you dont trust into a customers house? some of mine leave a lot of money floating around and I mean wads of it!

 

[Phil]

If reported the police have a duty to investigate the way they see fit. They might bin the case or they might take statements from all employees etc.

Who knows, I was with the police 10 years just over & there didn't seem to be much continuity how things were done. Depended on manpower, seriousness of crime, targets & stats!

It wasn't great & got worse hence I & many other civvies flew the nest. It was an eye opener to say the least

I didn't know you're an ex fuzz rocket?

 

[Ray Stafford]

If he is a hard worker and reliable then he already possesses good qualities. Not that makes innocent but liars and thieves don't usually have these qualities as it's easier for them to lie and steal to get what they want rather than work for it.

I wish this was true Ash, but I regret to say that in my experience, it isn't. Over the years I have discovered my share of thieving employees, and I wish that I could say that there was some way of identifying them before their crimes come to light. Unfortunately, there isn't. In fact, the worst of them appear to be very hard working and reliable, because that is what gives them the best opportunities. In this they look exactly like genuine hardworking and reliable employees.

To all those recommending setting a trap, I would say this. The last thief we caught red-handed (on CCTV and with signed confession) had handled probably 10 to 20 large cash transactions per day, every day for about 5 years. Probably 5,000 large transactions in total. By our best estimate, we think that this person probably committed between 5 and 20 actual thefts. So it was only between 1 in 250 and 1 in 1000 times that they actually succumbed to temptation.

On that basis, if we set 100 traps, and this person didn't take any of them, it is very probably that we would have learned nothing except to have more (misplaced) belief in their honesty. Its called the "black swan" problem. (constantly meeting white swans gives you the false belief that all swans are white.)

 

[Ray Stafford]

If reported the police have a duty to investigate the way they see fit. They might bin the case or they might take statements from all employees etc.

Who knows, I was with the police 10 years just over & there didn't seem to be much continuity how things were done. Depended on manpower, seriousness of crime, targets & stats!

In my experience Rocket, the police are brilliant in an emergency and where there is physical evidence (turning up at 3:00am when we have a break in) and absolutely uninterested in dealing with anything else.