Plastic or Copper piping?

[Gray0689]

You'll be fitting plastic rads next!

If they where efficient you bet I would

 

[Doodlebug]

You'll be fitting plastic rads next!

I hope you leave your number with this customer. Lol


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[petercj]

Sorry, you've lost me there. Who's attacking who? Not sure where you got that from. I asked you a question.


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I’m a brain surgeon, and I read the posts on this forum between operations for R&R!

I can tell you why you and your colleagues at British Gas see so much sludge, it’s because whilst charging around £25 a month for looking after your customer’s central heating systems (Home Care) you completely ignore the water in the system, i.e. no checking and no topping up of the inhibitor.

Then when the system is sludged up you tell your customers that for a mere £599.00 BG will power-flush the sludge out, and then thereafter you will actually check the state of the water.

No doubt you tell them that all their plastic pipe-work needs replacing as well!

“Looking after your world” … Best advice = read the small print in the BG Home Care contract very, very, carefully.

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[Dannypipe]

You're not really a brain surgeon are you....? Surely you would have said neurosurgeon to sound more realistic.

 

[DirksPlumbing]

So how do you explain the conclusion that those sludged up systems are due to the use of plastic pipe?

Not my conclusion. If you use inhibitor and make sure there is enough present plastic does tend not to sludge up excessively either.

The pressure inside a vented system is considerably greater than the 14 lbs per square inch on the outside of the pipework, so how does air get sucked in?

Who talks about air getting sucked in? And forget about a plastic pipe wall it is mere a thick membrane. How do you guess gets hydrogen into expansion vessels even though the pressure is equal both sides? It simply has to do with the fact that nature is based on chaos so if there is a low concentration on one side and a high concentration on the other side it will try to level them out.

If there was a vacuum inside the pipe and no barrier, then I could see how it might happen!

Accepting that copper is generally the better choice than plastic, I do believe plastic pipe gets made a scapegoat for all kinds of ills and mistakes made when fitting systems.

Agreed.

 

[Dannypipe]

How many people on here can honestly say they always check the header tank for muck and debris before draining a system?

Right here. I do, if it's an old system. I will hop into the loft and plug the tank. I have photo's a plently to prove it as I photograph just about everything I do. Cover your bum syndrome.

 

[Subby]

As a so-called "custard" (a term that I feel is derogatory to the people who pay you) I would always specify copper for any work I had done, and would avoid buying any house that was plumbed with plastic.

This goes back to very bad experiences with my 3rd house, which used plastic pipes.

PS They were grey plastic, but don't know what they were called.

That would be pvc-c, the problem with this stuff is that it tends to be very brittle, and splits. I have been to a call out in a very nice big house which had the living room ceiling come down due to the use of this under the floorboards. The whole house was plumbed with it, and it is way too expensive for the owner have someone replace all the pipes, so he has the constant worry of when another leak will spring.
All plastics are not made equal.

 

[Doodlebug]

I’m a brain surgeon, and I read the posts on this forum between operations for R&R!

I can tell you why you and your colleagues at British Gas see so much sludge, it’s because whilst charging around £25 a month for looking after your customer’s central heating systems (Home Care) you completely ignore the water in the system, i.e. no checking and no topping up of the inhibitor.

Then when the system is sludged up you tell your customers that for a mere £599.00 BG will power-flush the sludge out, and then thereafter you will actually check the state of the water.

No doubt you tell them that all their plastic pipe-work needs replacing as well!

“Looking after your world” … Best advice = read the small print in the BG Home Care contract very, very, carefully.

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

The inhibitor levels in a central heating system are checked on a first visit inspection at the very start of the contract. The customer is then advised on having the inhibitor levels topped up if needed, it's the customers choice whether they want us to do this work or not, we can't force them. The water in the central heating system is not covered under any contract agreement and it is well displayed in the terms of the contract which the customer gets a fresh copy of every 12 months. The exclusions of the contract are no longer in small print but are laid out in a way that the customer actually can't miss them, but how many customers read the terms and conditions of their contract, yes you guessed it, not many. The inhibitor levels are not checked every year on an annual service visit as this is not part of a service. Their is certain things that are out of control of British Gas, ie: customers or decorators removing radiators or installing fancy modern radiators and not topping up the inhibitor levels. The customers who do top up there inhibitor don't know what they are doing and just put it in the header tank where it stays. What is it you expect British Gas to do? It's clearly written in the terms and conditions of the contract what customers are getting for their money before they take out the contract.
I look forward to your reply Petercj.

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[Dannypipe]

Doodle, someone else made the presumption that you were a BG employee, and you quickly defended yourself by stating you were infact anti BG.

I think this happened as far as my memory serves me correct. Can you confirm? Just interested.

 

[Doodlebug]

Doodle, someone else made the presumption that you were a BG employee, and you quickly defended yourself by stating you were infact anti BG.

I think this happened as far as my memory serves me correct. Can you confirm? Just interested.

When did I state I was anti BG? Lol I may have stated that I don't agree with everything that British Gas do, but I deal with facts and I don't like it when people make assumptions. British Gas make mistakes but the important thing is that when they make mistakes they put it right. Did you know that British Gas is now regulated by the FSA so it's in the companies interest to deal with any complaints at ground level.


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[DirksPlumbing]

That would be pvc-c, the problem with this stuff is that it tends to be very brittle, and splits.

If it is gray and brittle it is PVC-U(S). PVC-C tends to be beige and does not contain softener. Therefore it remains flexible for a lot longer. Fitted quite a bit of it long time ago (Friatec). No hassle up to day. PVC-U as well lacks the antibac properties.

 

[Dannypipe]

When did I state I was anti BG? Lol I may have stated that I don't agree with everything that British Gas do, but I deal with facts and I don't like it when people make assumptions. British Gas make mistakes but the important thing is that when they make mistakes they put it right. Did you know that British Gas is now regulated by the FSA so it's in the companies interest to deal with any complaints at ground level.


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I'm not picking on you, but you said and I quote:

'I'm not the British Gas Howard pmsl
In fact I am critical of British Gas myself.'

 

[Doodlebug]

I'm not picking on you, but you said and I quote:

'I'm not the British Gas Howard pmsl
In fact I am critical of British Gas myself.'

Yes that's correct, I am critical of some things they do. Not everyone is perfect.


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[Dannypipe]

For the record, I'm not anti BG at all, infact I have a masive respect for them. It's like if you are religious, you respect the bible/koran or whatever literature suits your religion.

BG have been around a long time, and have a massive wealth of experience.....but they do rip people off. So it's not all the 'good word' LOL.

 

[petercj]

The inhibitor levels in a central heating system are checked on a first visit inspection at the very start of the contract. The customer is then advised on having the inhibitor levels topped up if needed, it's the customers choice whether they want us to do this work or not, we can't force them. The water in the central heating system is not covered under any contract agreement and it is well displayed in the terms of the contract which the customer gets a fresh copy of every 12 months. The exclusions of the contract are no longer in small print but are laid out in a way that the customer actually can't miss them, but how many customers read the terms and conditions of their contract, yes you guessed it, not many. The inhibitor levels are not checked every year on an annual service visit as this is not part of a service. Their is certain things that are out of control of British Gas, ie: customers or decorators removing radiators or installing fancy modern radiators and not topping up the inhibitor levels. The customers who do top up there inhibitor don't know what they are doing and just put it in the header tank where it stays. What is it you expect British Gas to do? It's clearly written in the terms and conditions of the contract what customers are getting for their money before they take out the contract.
I look forward to your reply Petercj.

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The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

 

[Dannypipe]

I'm just trying to suss you out Doodle. It's my nature to do so!

 

[Doodlebug]

For the record, I'm not anti BG at all, infact I have a masive respect for them. It's like if you are religious, you respect the bible/koran or whatever literature suits your religion.

BG have been around a long time, and have a massive wealth of experience.....but they do rip people off. So it's not all the 'good word' LOL.

If I offer you a product for say £600 and you know you can get product for say £400 but you still decide to take the £600 product, who's ripping who off?


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[Dannypipe]

If I offer you a product for say £600 and you know you can get product for say £400 but you still decide to take the £600 product, who's ripping who off?


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Great answer, and one which I really don't have a smart alec response to.

 

[Dannypipe]

The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

Do you think the same will be made of other large companies (the AA for example)?

I find it un-nerving the way big business is squeezing out the small firm.

I try to offer the best possible service I can. 24 hour call out, and I personally will bend over backwards for a customer, as I know it helps MY business grow. Big business can offer the same but do the engineers/plumbers really care, or do they just want to get their shift done and go home?

 

[Doodlebug]

The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

The small print? Where? What small print? Do you really want me to take a photo of the terms and post on here? The exclusions of the contract are printed very clearly and even highlighted. You say £25 a month, who exactly are you referring to? Every customer pays a different price depending on what's system or boiler they have, ie: a customer with an unvented cylinder will obviously pay more than a customer with a standard indirect cylinder. It's like insuring you car, I've got a porsche and you've got a robin reliant, who's insurance do you think will be the most? British Gas fined millions for poor handling of complaint, I don't doubt it, like I have said before, British Gas aren't perfect but are doing there very best to be as close to perfect as is possible. Complaints is something that the company are trying to reduce and I know this as its down at customer facing level that matters.
You don't seem to be reading my posts Petercj, I'm now losing the will to live pmsl


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[Dannypipe]

But all the time you Doodle seem like a metaphorical stick of BG rock.

Crack you in half and it says 'Doodle, British Gas!' - In the middle

 

[Dannypipe]

and I should add, there are a lot more people shouting BG down than supporting them.

 

[Doodlebug]

Do you think the same will be made of other large companies (the AA for example)?

I find it un-nerving the way big business is squeezing out the small firm.

I try to offer the best possible service I can. 24 hour call out, and I personally will bend over backwards for a customer, as I know it helps MY business grow. Big business can offer the same but do the engineers/plumbers really care, or do they just want to get their shift done and go home?

My mate works for himself and I know how hard he works and it's a lot harder than me. He is a very very good engineer and is never short of work because of how good he is. It's a shame that there is a lot of cowboys out there and it's the cowboys that push people to coming to British Gas. You will always have work if your good, as most of your work will eventually come from word of mouth. If a customer is dissatisfied they tell say 10 people but a customer who is satisfied will only tell 5 people, shame but true.


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[Doodlebug]

But all the time you Doodle seem like a metaphorical stick of BG rock.

Crack you in half and it says 'Doodle, British Gas!' - In the middle

Pmsl they pay my wages. To be honest mate it wouldn't matter if it was British Gas or any other company, I will always say what I see. I don't doubt there are a small minority of people who will let the company down. British Gas will always get a lot of stick its the nature of the British people. In America they praise a person or establishment that is successful, in this country it seems people like to criticise anyone who is doing well. British Gas employ a lot of people, isn't that a good thing for the economy?


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[Dannypipe]

I hope so. I am constantly busy. Working late to get the back log done, but I worry because if the phone stops ringing, I can't pay my bills. It's often a pain that the phone rings just when I don't want it to, but it's what puts bread on the table.

I have been offered a job interview with BG a few times, and always declined as my business is my third child and I love it.

Yesterday I worked in so many random places, and ended up in the evening working in a farmers field, in the night (with head torch) fixing a cattle water trough, (I grew up in a village called Cowden - lots of farmers!!).

I just thought, I love this, working for myself, employing a couple of good friends, and meeting new people all the time. I'd hate to become part of the machine. Just clocking in and out. It's not the same. I as take pride in because it's MY business.

I have met some brilliant BG engineers though. The old boys, who's knowledge is just amazing.

 

[Doodlebug]

I hope so. I am constantly busy. Working late to get the back log done, but I worry because if the phone stops ringing, I can't pay my bills. It's often a pain that the phone rings just when I don't want it to, but it's what puts bread on the table.

I have been offered a job interview with BG a few times, and always declined as my business is my third child and I love it.

Yesterday I worked in so many random places, and ended up in the evening working in a farmers field, in the night (with head torch) fixing a cattle water trough, (I grew up in a village called Cowden - lots of farmers!!).

I just thought, I love this, working for myself, employing a couple of good friends, and meeting new people all the time. I'd hate to become part of the machine. Just clocking in and out. It's not the same. I as take pride in because it's MY business.

I have met some brilliant BG engineers though. The old boys, who's knowledge is just amazing.

I admire you mate, you do what I'd love to do but I took the easy option. I like the fact I can switch my phone off at the end of my shift.


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[petercj]

Rumour has it that Doodlebug is a cyborg, and that he was created in a secret BG laboratory located in the Welsh valleys - people say he can stick his finger in a flu and get a totally accurate gas reading flash in front of his eyes!

He can only respond positively to criticism of BG because his reactions have been programmed into his cpu at BG HQ!

He never sleeps, they just stand him in a corner and charge his batteries every 12 hours.

BG plan to release 20 new Doodlebugs over the next 12 months.

;-)

 

[Doodlebug]

Rumour has it that Doodlebug is a cyborg, and that he was created in a secret BG laboratory located in the Welsh valleys - people say he can stick his finger in a flu and get a totally accurate gas reading flash in front of his eyes!

He can only respond positively to criticism of BG because his reactions have been programmed into his cpu at BG HQ!

He never sleeps, they just stand him in a corner and charge his batteries every 12 hours.

BG plan to release 20 new Doodlebugs over the next 12 months.

;-)

Pmsl I once got My finger stuck in the flue of an open flued boiler. I noticed the flue at the back of the boiler looked corroded, so I squeezed down the side of the boiler and poked the corroded area with my finger. My finger went straight through the flue and I couldn't remove it without it cutting into me. Luckily I could just about reach my phone and call a colleague. Ten minutes I was stuck there waiting, that was a long ten minutes, I was thinking all sorts, I imagined the fire brigade turning up and all sorts, I was thinking oh no, I'm gone be in the local papers for this. I was so relieved to see my mate turn up and even more relieved when he managed to dismantle the flue and release me. I nearly did a Croppie and kissed him pmsl


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[Dannypipe]

Well I'm not going to pick on Doodle just because he's BG employed. He can clearly take a joke, and also knows a lot about the business, so it’s an attribute to the forum that he's willing to come on and spend his valuable time advising others.

Now we just need to persuade him to set up his own business, and we'll all be happy!! LOL

 

[petercj]

Well I'm not going to pick on Doodle just because he's BG employed. He can clearly take a joke, and also knows a lot about the business, so it’s an attribute to the forum that he's willing to come on and spend his valuable time advising others.

Now we just need to persuade him to set up his own business, and we'll all be happy!! LOL

I don't pick on anyone - my criticisms are of BG. If Doodlebug chooses to defend BG that's up to him. It's not a personal issue, which I think Doodlebug does appreciate. The cyborg thing is just a bit of banter.

 

[Dannypipe]

So Pete. You're a brain surgeon right? 🙂 LOL.

 

[Doodlebug]

I don't pick on anyone - my criticisms are of BG. If Doodlebug chooses to defend BG that's up to him. It's not a personal issue, which I think Doodlebug does appreciate. The cyborg thing is just a bit of banter.

Are you in denial Peter? Lol


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[Doodlebug]

Well I'm not going to pick on Doodle just because he's BG employed. He can clearly take a joke, and also knows a lot about the business, so it’s an attribute to the forum that he's willing to come on and spend his valuable time advising others.

Now we just need to persuade him to set up his own business, and we'll all be happy!! LOL

Thanks Danny.


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[petercj]

Thanks Danny.


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I hope you enjoy the smell of burning martyr Danny! lol

 

[Bernie2]

Might be a brain surgeon but probably little work about perhaps!!!! Open a young man today and out pops a syllabus learnt in college or training centre, complete with set answers. Perhaps we do have cyborgs!!!! Joke